Goths & Cartoons [Updated 3/23/08]

[GilAskan]

This is a topic I've been wanting to create for a long time now, but have never made an effort to pull through all the way. So here I go-

Basic Outlines and Goals of This Thread

1) List and document the appearance of goth characters within children's cartoons, comics, and related media.

2) Examine how the emergence of these characters will affect both goth culture and popular culture.

3) Speculate on the origin of the trend, and trace patterns to determine where it may be headed.

Guidelines

While not acting as official rules to be enforced, I would request the following of those who choose to use this thread:

1) Talk only about and around goth characters in popular mediums of animation and artistry, specifically, those intended for CHILDREN.

I strongly request that people DO NOT post about web-comics or web-series made by adults or teenagers for adults or teenagers, such as the Foamy "Ill Will Press" animations.

2) Please, at least answer or respond to one of the posted discussion topics. Don't come in here and just say "IDK" or something of that nature.

3) I will be adding to this thread as new information is presented to me. If you would like to contribute to this thread's informational section, please PM me. If I find a post of yours that I would like to include in my informational section, I will PM you.

[Update 1 - 3/23/2008]

Sorry for the lateness. I've been trying to hunt down and watch a lot of individual episodes to evaluate their place in all this, which has been slowling me down. Hopefully, I can get things rolling at a nice clip.  

[GilAskan]

The Trend

The goth culture has existed since the late 70's, but it's influence on popular media didn't truly begin until roughly a decade later. While goth had long been influenced by film and literature, the culture didn't start outputting it's own influence until the late 80's and early 90's.

Starting in the early 90's with Ahh! Real Monsters, a growing trend of gothic themes and characters in children's television (particularly animation) is apparent. A large portion of children's animation now features at least one goth character, or explores the themes.

What follows will hopefully be a comprehensive list of series which do so.

Examples

Ahh! Real Monsters

Title: Aaahh!!! Real Monsters
Debut: 1994
Channel: Nickelodeon



Concept
Developed by Klasky-Csupo (more well known for their work on Rugrats), Aahhh!!! Real Monsters would now be thought of as an odd amalgamation of Pixar's "Monsters, Inc." and Burton's "A Nightmare Before Christmas". The series told the tale of three young monsters training at an academy for their kind. It was their job as monsters to travel into the city and scare humans.

Goth Elements
The series dark color palette, bleak take on the world, and sharp with were all very gothic. Given the bright kid-friendly nature of most Nickelodeon shows at the time, the series is quite startling.

The soundtrack featured plucky piano and faux-harpsichord pieces, and were very atmospheric. As can be heard, to a degree, by the opening theme: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ih-O3KC6hzs (excuse the poor quality)

On a particular side note, one character, the Grombel, stood out more than others. The sexually ambiguous headmaster went back and forth between a gritty baritone and a screeching falsetto (a la Peter Murphy), wore fish-nets, and was an odd father figure to the group.

Goth-iness: The show has no relation to the culture whatsoever, but will appeal to many within the culture. 5/10

6teen

Title: 6teen
Debut: 2004
Channel: Teletoon (rebroadcast on Nickelodeon and Nicktoons Channel)

Concept: 6teen was created with a unique approach to children’s television. Many of the creators noticed that most children’s cartoons are very condescending, however, many children develop a taste for more intelligent writing at an early age while watching adult sitcoms with their parents. 6teen is a comedy-drama following six 16-year old teenagers and their daily goings-on at their local mall, all written with a sharp pen meant to meet kids on a fairly intelligent level. The Canadian-produced show features 2D, computer-aided art style (similar to Foster’s Home for Imaginary Friends). The series doesn’t pull punches too often; the show has direct references to sexual attraction (particularly breast size), menstrual pains, homosexuality, and numerous other issues often thought “too mature” for children.



Goth Elements: One particular episode heavily revolves around Goths, entitled “Lights Out”. The episode primarily follows Jude (a slacker skater archetype) as he tries to relate to his girlfriend after she suddenly turns to the goth culture. She (and numerous friends she makes) go on to return in future episodes.

Unfortunately, the series mostly casts the goth characters in a negative light. Throughout the episode, they’re shown as being very image obsessed, pretentious, and dour. The episode also bears suggestion that they may be death cultists, or something similar. Some may argue that the show is mocking “mall goth” trends, particularly when a sarcastic main character refers to the local goths as “so hardcore”.

Later in the episode, the goths are presented in a more friendly light, however, the show seems may be interpretted as saying that the friendliness is contrary to goth nature, particularly when goth "leader" Morgana scowls at her "followers" when they converse with "normals".



Goth rating: Possibly mocking the mall goth culture, or poorly researching the actual culture; either way, it has very little to do with goth. Though, given the sharpness of the show’s writing, I imagine the former is more likely than the latter. 3/10

Danny Phantom

Title: Danny Phantom
Debut: 2004
Channel: Nickelodeon

Concept: Following a very Spiderman-archetype, Danny Phantom is an action-comedy following the exploits of Danny Fenton. Raised as part of a family of ghost hunters, he ends up (through a freak accident, naturally) endowed with supernatural, ghost-like powers. Danny chooses to assume the identity of "Danny Phantom" while fighting crime and protecting the city from evil, all the while, trying to hide his secret identity and survive the daily expectations of a high-school student.



Goth Elements: The primarily influx of the show's goth elements come from one particular character- Sam Manson, one of Danny's best friends and long-time love interest. A self-proclaimed goth, Sam is the sensible and level headed member of Danny's group. Besides her goth tendencies, she's also a political activist and an "ultra-recyclo-vegetarian".

In the series, Sam makes numerous reference to goth culture. Among them include a nod to cyber-goths, a mention of a goth music festival (a clear allusion to Gottik Wave Treffen), gloomy goth poetry readings, and more. In Sam's bedroom, you can clearly see posters featuring the logos of Einsturzende Neubauten (early 80's electronic and industrial group popular at goth clubs) and the Sisters of Mercy. Sam also mentions that she has a collection of records from "early punk groups".

These are the major mentions, and I may have to go back to add more specifics.



Goth-iness: With references to major events and elements of the goth culture, and direct references to specific bands, the show does a lot right. The depiction of the major goth character in a positive light is also pleasant, however, some may find her political and social inclinations somewhat stereotypical. 9/10

Commonalities

Discuss:  

[GilAskan]

Reserved, but may not be needed.  

[Rellik San]

Whilst not strictly goth, more Metal... theres Lobo.

Ermmm lessee... for the obvious one, Raven from Teen Titans. I suppose in terms of appearance, Dennis the Menace (the UK version not the crappy US version).

Theres also the ex-Kerrang strip Continuum which provided us with a pair of goths (see Ray Zells website) but thats more teen media then anything else.

Theres also the animated form of Yumi from the Hi Hi Puffy Ami Yumi Show.

Theres a couple of transformers that could qualify in terms of look and personality, (I'll get a list for you later).


Thats all I can think of for now.  

[GilAskan]

Rellik San

Whilst not strictly goth, more Metal... theres Lobo.

Ermmm lessee... for the obvious one, Raven from Teen Titans. I suppose in terms of appearance, Dennis the Menace (the UK version not the crappy US version).

Theres also the ex-Kerrang strip Continuum which provided us with a pair of goths (see Ray Zells website) but thats more teen media then anything else.

Theres also the animated form of Yumi from the Hi Hi Puffy Ami Yumi Show.

Theres a couple of transformers that could qualify in terms of look and personality, (I'll get a list for you later).


Thats all I can think of for now.

I have more than a few I'll be adding to the list, I just haven't gotten around to it yet. And it may take me a while.

Yet to be added to the list (characters, as well as whole series):

Sam from Danny Phantom
As Told by Ginger
Goth Girl (she was recurring, but never named) from Mr. Meaty
Edgar & Ellen
Ophelia from The Life and Times of Juniper Lee
Courage the Cowardly Dog
Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy

And while it's certainly not intended for children, I may make an exception and add Venture Bros. onto the list. The large number of connections between it and the goth culture are worth mention.  

[Awesome Akwardness]

There's one show I found while channel surfing once called Growing Up Creepie .
It comes on..Discovery kids I think..It's about a goth girl raised by a family of insects apparently.

And I think there were also a couple in the disney cartoon series of Hercules,if I remember right.

Does Lydia from the Beetle Juice cartoon count?  

[GilAskan]

Blackrose Kaire

There's one show I found while channel surfing once called Growing Up Creepie .
It comes on..Discovery kids I think..It's about a goth girl raised by a family of insects apparently.

And I think there were also a couple in the disney cartoon series of Hercules,if I remember right.

I'll check them out.

Blackrose Kaire

Does Lydia from the Beetle Juice cartoon count?

I was considering it, but I'm a bit split. It was a kids cartoon, definitely. Then again, it's adapted from a film intended for adults.  

[NekoYasha09er]

Does the whole Invader Zim count with Gaz and Dib?  

[Freedom Fire]

I like Germaine from the Foamy cartoons. She can be stereotypical sometimes, but in general I really like what she has to say. I want to read the Neurotically Yours manga but I don't know where I'd find it.  

[Spooky Wasabi Princess]

Ingrid Third from Fillmore! I love that chick.


The Addams Family cartoon was intended for kids.

Onyx from that Trollz cartoon.  

[GilAskan]

spooky_sez

Ingrid Third from Fillmore! I love that chick.

I had forgotten that one. I loved that show.

spooky_sez

The Addams Family cartoon was intended for kids.

Indeed.  

[GilAskan]

Freedom Fire

I like Germaine from the Foamy cartoons. She can be stereotypical sometimes, but in general I really like what she has to say.

That's an example of what this thread is NOT for. As pointed out in the first post, this is for mainstream television and film intended for children.  

[GilAskan]

NekoYasha09er

Does the whole Invader Zim count with Gaz and Dib?

They'll be in eventually, but I'd probably put them in last. Simply because I'm annoyed by the show's overexposure.  

[Rellik San]

I suppose we should be honest here... most kids watch south park... so theres the south park goths. But I guess thats more only if your going to use the venture bros.  

[Awesome Akwardness]

Oh yeah,there was an episode of Recess once that had the geeky girl,dressed up like a goth.