Repeating history

[WeHappyFew]

Today in history class we were discussing the crusades, and then he asked whether or not we were in a crusades right now, but rather for religious reasons for political reasons. Then i thought of the idea that history repeats itself. Also, it seems that we've learned nothing from history, we haven't stopped doing evil things, we've just gotten better at it. To the muslims this is a crusade, but what war can this be compared to in the U.S. eyes?  

[Tsubaki Aoi]

are we doomed to repeat the mistakes of the past? to our eyes this is liberation and to theirs this is a attempt to conquer more land, all wars come to the same meaning at the end, why can't we just learn from the past?  

[Doctor_Orc]

The greatest sin is ignorance.
(and I hope I don’t offend a lot of people with this, but here it goes)
In recent times, or like some say, in the post modern era, people are with the strange notion that now things are better that they ever were.
This is a logical fallacy on very different level. Being new and modern is not synonym to being better. But little by little this strange notion creeps into our minds.
Then there’s America, an intellectually diminished country. For the average American, America is the world. They have it all there, and all of that is because of “the American way”, no other country in the world has anything to teach them (no wonder most of them can’t pinpoint their own country in a globe, let alone other ones). Exporting this American way, strikes American as the only way of making other people as happy as they are. To modernize them, to turn them into a democracy, to implant the capitalist system, etc.
Political systems grow slowly, and implanting a system created by other in a far older culture generates ripples and clashes. It’s filled with fail from the start.
The main problem here is ignorance again. And ignorance by part of the Americans, their foreign relations are “weird”. They expect that all the other countries think like an American, and are incapable or reaching a compromise and trying to see the problem trough the other eyes (this would imply studying foreign cultures without bias, and embracing difference). Tolerance is for fools. Tolerance is something someone on a high horse gives to someone lower than him. Acceptance is different; and it’s the key.

Wars have, for a long time now, been made not for land, but for resources. Oil in this case. Just watch Timor now. The Australians haven’t done nothing to stabilize the place, because they want the oil there. The Portuguese have been there just for their good heart. Even when east Timor was a colony, it wasn’t because of oil.  

[Tsubaki Aoi]

your words are wise, i can agree with all that you say.  

[LightMousy]

luvSimpson3

Today in history class we were discussing the crusades, and then he asked whether or not we were in a crusades right now, but rather for religious reasons for political reasons. Then i thought of the idea that history repeats itself. Also, it seems that we've learned nothing from history, we haven't stopped doing evil things, we've just gotten better at it. To the muslims this is a crusade, but what war can this be compared to in the U.S. eyes?

Its the crusades without a true rallying reason(thats why there were many crusades)
This just might be my democrat speaking but its a war that is oddly familiar, christians think that they were better so lets go kill them, it doesnt make sense.  

[WeHappyFew]

They're all good points, and concerning the war, I like the way that dailyshow host Jon Stewart worded it, that americans see democracy like neosporin. All of Iraq's wounds and terror will all dissapear as soon as they have democracy. But the problems in there will take years to heal, if they ever can heal....  

[the grey seer]

luvSimpson3

They're all good points, and concerning the war, I like the way that dailyshow host Jon Stewart worded it, that americans see democracy like neosporin. All of Iraq's wounds and terror will all dissapear as soon as they have democracy. But the problems in there will take years to heal, if they ever can heal....

those wounds won't heal  

[Alonso Quijana]

Agreed. I don't think you can just say, "Alright, here's a nice helping of democracy for you. Pick your president and solve your problems." First of all, democracy doesn't work for everyone. With all the different ethnic groups in Iraq, elections are going to be hellish. Unfortunately we can't turn back time and prevent Western powers from dividing up Africa and the Middle East haphazardly.  

[the grey seer]

gnomeguy1138

Agreed. I don't think you can just say, "Alright, here's a nice helping of democracy for you. Pick your president and solve your problems." First of all, democracy doesn't work for everyone. With all the different ethnic groups in Iraq, elections are going to be hellish. Unfortunately we can't turn back time and prevent Western powers from dividing up Africa and the Middle East haphazardly.

if i had it my way would have us have 1 nation  

[WeHappyFew]

We are trying to "help" the wrong culture. The iraquis were relatively well, they lived simply and did what they could to live. But right now hundreds of thousands of african children are dying of disease and famine. Instead of violently trying to "spread democracy" or whatever the hell we're doing over there, we should be providing for those poor kids.
However seeing as our economy is in on the floor, before we should even think of helping other's economy we should get our own screwed up economy straight.  

[Tsubaki Aoi]

you're right to help others we must first help and heal ourselves. the people in Iraq were OK like it's been mentioned, and we just had to mess it up, i mean the old bush knew this was going to happen if the US went in and he did the wright thing by staying out, but his stupid son had to go in because he did not like the thought of having some people say that his family was too soft. stare  

[Doctor_Orc]

The actual regimes around the world are supported by a Constitution.
The Constitution is the corner stone of a stable regime and country. The Constitution must be built in a way that it pleases the vast majority of people in that country, which means that it has to represent them and uphold their values and to give them special rights. If the constitution falls, the majority of the people will be hurt, because their way of life will also fall. Do nailing a good Constitution ensures that “the people” stay calm. The only ones that don’t stay put are the minorities. Those don’t really care about the constitution, and as such, they protest. These are the ones that the politicians try to win with subsides and promises.
The problem is that a Constitution as America knows it is more materialistic oriented. It focus on individual rights.
And a Constitution for a country like Iraq… I just don’t see it. Which is the majority over there?
You have to see, we have more worldly possessions than God in our lives, so we uphold a constitution, because if it falls, its chaos, and we lose it all. Those people over there have more God in their lives than stuff. And it’s the way they understand God that divides them into small groups. You can’t put them together with promises of “stuff”, it won’t really work.

Also, in Africa there are a lot of problems related with Democracy right now. Those peoples weren’t matured for Democracy. Democracy was presented as a way of their voice be heard, they come together and vote, and the person they chose is president and all problems are magically solved. And then the one who wins it not the guy you voted but the guy someone else did… Obviously there’s something wrong, this is not democracy has it was explained!

It’s so messed up.

In the time of kings their authority came straight from a power nobody contested, from a higher plane. Now it comes from the people, and people don’t trust each other… so the authority of politicians is placed in check. They are just people like us, except richer and dirtier.  

[WeHappyFew]

Of course, have you ever heard of a POOR president? or a poor politician? Now a days millions of dollars are spent in running for the presidency, although there are sponsors, they still have to be REALLY rich, therefore they don't experience the same things as a middle class or lower class sees, they can't really represent the people, because they have no idea of what there trying to change...  

[the grey seer]

empty promises is what it is  

[WeHappyFew]

Jariah Syn

empty promises is what it is

what do you mean by that?