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Is a Full Moon Esbat Ritual Really Necessary? Goto Page: 1 2 3 [>] [»|]

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Esbats are:
  absolutely necessary
  not really necessary
  only if you feel like it
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MidnightLetter
Vice Captain

PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 8:00 am
I have subscriptions to various pagan newsletters/email, etc... this was in my inbox this morning and to say the least it was a bit startling.
Quote:
In conversations with students, and indeed with many longer term Wiccans as well, it seems to me that full moon Esbat rituals have become the accepted necessity, the expected norm if you like and this worries me. If you look at the evidential history of Wicca, in the beginning under Gerald Gardner rituals were rarely conducted at full moons and instead it was the Sabbats that were the main focus of group ritual. In truth, the full moon Esbats we tend to conduct now came about in later years. That’s Ok but I guess what worries me is the potential issue of conducting a full moon Esbat because it’s expected rather than because it’s wanted.

source


Thoughts? Do you agree, disagree?  
PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 8:48 am
I definitly agree. It's stupid to do a ritual simply because it's expected. That's like going to church because everyone expects you to. If there isn't feeling in it, if you don't want to do it, there's no meaning and no power.  

Tari_Leralonde


ncsweet
Crew

PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 11:12 am
I don't know...it doesn't seem all that unreasonable to expect that 8 times a year and once or twice per month (depending on if you celebrate just the full moon or both the full and dark/new) that ones followers perform some sort of ritual. I mean if you aren't into that sort of thing, then maybe it's not the right path.

I agree completely that it can be hard when you aren't in the mood, or aren't feeling well, etc..., but there is some leeway, plus there are any number of ways to do small, but meaningful rituals - that don't necessarily take up a lot of time or energy, but still are ways of honoring the Esbat.  
PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 11:40 am
Esbats are a perfectly reasonable expectation of practice, for Wiccans.
The Sabbats follow the cycle of the Sun through the Wheel of the Year - it is about how the God travels through birth to death, and then rebirth. The Esbats are primarily about honouring the cycles of the Moon, and the journey of the Goddess. While the polarity of Lord and Lady is present in all rituals, it's important to honour both cycles as they naturally occur, as well. Wiccans see our deities and their nature reflected in those cycles.  

Morgandria

Aged Shapeshifter


doistu

PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 4:22 pm
User Image - Blocked by "Display Image" Settings. Click to show.

As I'm not a wiccan of any kind I don't perform esbat rituals. I have very little space and live with my parents which oftenestricts what I do. They aren't against my paganism but they are very very nosey.

Anyhow, I may do a little something for each esbat but not a full blown ritual. I don't even go all out for sabbats. I do celebrate but in my own special way. Lots of communication with deities and, sometimes, Ahku.

I do observe and appreciate the lunar cycle though.  
PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 7:16 pm
Necessity would probably depend on what sort of tradition you're following, eh?

In general, though, it's my intuitive feeling that if your practice is all just about sabbats and/or esbats, you're not living the Path. You're being the equivalent of the Sunday Christian whose expression of religiosity is nothing more than going to church for one hour once a week. When they're not in church, they freely ignore the teachings of their denomination, which to my mind, spoils the point of following a religious path. In a sense this might be what the author is attempting to get at with the statement about expectation versus wanting, but I'm not sure it's even boiled down to that.

There is something to be said for doing something because it is part of your tradition or because it is an expectation. There are many good things to be said about discipline and tradition, be it regularly following esbats, a daily meditation practice, daily alter prayers/devotional, or what have you. Sometimes we become things by doing them. We learn things by doing too.

I think one of the best things I did early on was forcing myself to honor esbats regularly. It isn't something I was really excited about, but was something I felt I should start doing. So I did, and I worked to make it interesting. Now, it's something I simply always do and it's become something beautiful and wonderful. It is indeed worth it to do something at times even if you don't particularly want to.  

Starlock


raging-earth

PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2009 9:54 pm
I'm not a Wiccan so I can't speak for that group, but as a Pagan I feel the importance of acknowledging the Full/New Moons. I don't do elaborate rituals, but I do take a few moments out of my evening to notice the moon is there and acknowledge the important role it plays on Earth.

I do agree with the article in that doing a ritual because you are expected to isn't good. Every religion seems to have that problem with something and while it isn't a really big deal, it could probably lead to other issues of either leniency of one's religion's rules or turning other important things into a meaningless ritual.

...i'm drawing my own history.
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 15, 2009 6:56 am
I usually don't have the means to do very elaborate rituals. Despite that I won't be spending a night in a place where I can do anything special for awhile. That aside, I don't view it as necessary. Esbats, I feel, are a way of praising the Goddess at her peak. Therefore, I feel, someone could show as much love and appreciation just meditating on thoughts concerning the full moon, preferably outside, or say a simple prayer, and that could mean even more than a large elaborate ritual preformed by someone who didn't mean it so much.

PS: I'm stating my beliefs as a Pagan, not specifically as a Wiccan. Please keep that in mind.
 

Katsumi Aki


GoddessAttuned

Mind-boggling Fatcat

PostPosted: Wed Jul 08, 2009 10:45 pm
raging-earth
I'm not a Wiccan so I can't speak for that group, but as a Pagan I feel the importance of acknowledging the Full/New Moons. I don't do elaborate rituals, but I do take a few moments out of my evening to notice the moon is there and acknowledge the important role it plays on Earth.

I do agree with the article in that doing a ritual because you are expected to isn't good. Every religion seems to have that problem with something and while it isn't a really big deal, it could probably lead to other issues of either leniency of one's religion's rules or turning other important things into a meaningless ritual.

...i'm drawing my own history.

you took the words right out of my mouth.
 
PostPosted: Wed Aug 26, 2009 10:21 pm
the sabbats represent the god. we need to worship goddess also thats why esbat rituals are nessesary.  

Doc Dillamond


A Sentimental Heart

PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2009 12:51 pm
The moon dictates my emotions and how I deal with things. Without giving thanks and worshiping the Goddess I just don't feel healthy in all aspects.
But I guess it depends on you and your Tradition.  
PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2009 1:35 pm
I observe the full and new moon cycle, but I don't actively do anything.
Actually I've only done one sabbat ritual.
I'm not all that certain what to do for the sabbats and esbats. So I just acknowledge them and let them pass.  

kage no neko

Invisible Phantom

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Morgandria

Aged Shapeshifter

PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2009 1:44 pm
TheBelikov
The moon dictates my emotions and how I deal with things. Without giving thanks and worshiping the Goddess I just don't feel healthy in all aspects.
But I guess it depends on you and your Tradition.


I think more perhaps on the individual, and not so much the tradition...although I can't speak for all traditions of Witchcraft.

In British Traditional Wicca, though, the Esbats are to honour the Lady; it really has nothing to do with how an individual person feels or deals with things. (And if you want to get really picky, Water rules emotion - not the Moon.)

Obviously if you're performing ritual alone, it is sort of immaterial, as Wicca isn't possible to practice solo.  
PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2009 3:18 pm
Morgandria
TheBelikov
The moon dictates my emotions and how I deal with things. Without giving thanks and worshiping the Goddess I just don't feel healthy in all aspects.
But I guess it depends on you and your Tradition.


I think more perhaps on the individual, and not so much the tradition...although I can't speak for all traditions of Witchcraft.

In British Traditional Wicca, though, the Esbats are to honour the Lady; it really has nothing to do with how an individual person feels or deals with things. (And if you want to get really picky, Water rules emotion - not the Moon.)

Obviously if you're performing ritual alone, it is sort of immaterial, as Wicca isn't possible to practice solo.


I was just giving why I perform a ritual during the full moon.
Perhaps I should've added "and" between the first two sentences, eh? During my full moon rituals I'm both "honoring" the Goddess and making myself feel better. ( To me the Goddess is the moon btw. )
Alone meaning what exactly?  

A Sentimental Heart


Morgandria

Aged Shapeshifter

PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2009 4:00 pm
TheBelikov

I was just giving why I perform a ritual during the full moon.
Perhaps I should've added "and" between the first two sentences, eh? During my full moon rituals I'm both "honoring" the Goddess and making myself feel better. ( To me the Goddess is the moon btw. )
Alone meaning what exactly?


No worries. Which Goddess in particular are you speaking of?

And alone - as in, singular. One individual. Wicca is a coven-based practice. Even a properly initiated member of a Wiccan coven can't practice Wicca alone - they need to be with the group to properly practice the rites.  
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