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Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 12:39 pm
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Posted: Sat Jan 09, 2010 9:21 am
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Posted: Sat Jan 09, 2010 11:32 am
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Posted: Thu Jan 21, 2010 12:24 pm
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Posted: Fri Jan 22, 2010 12:08 pm
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Posted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 6:55 pm
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Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 5:58 pm
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Scraps 2-point-0 I was raised Jewish, but I've become something of an atheistic-spiritualist myself. I believe there are forces out there we as humans can't understand, but they are only higher powers, and not a higher consciousness-- that is, I don't think there is any deity that can be personified. I think reincarnation may exist just because of the constant exchange of forces in physics and biology. Anyway, I don't think anyone can say any religion is "right" or "wrong." Every group will think their culture is the best when things are going well for them-- it's a natural way for humans to think. There is no way to solve any debate of this nature, and to debate it further only destroys relationships when all most people want is peace. Very true. From what I've been taught, Christians do not worship Jesus, his crucifixion metaphorically provides a bridge between us and God so that we can pray to him. The Bible has been altered somewhat through translation, however, the jist of the Bible still exists.
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Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 7:55 pm
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Celestial_Mana Scraps 2-point-0 I was raised Jewish, but I've become something of an atheistic-spiritualist myself. I believe there are forces out there we as humans can't understand, but they are only higher powers, and not a higher consciousness-- that is, I don't think there is any deity that can be personified. I think reincarnation may exist just because of the constant exchange of forces in physics and biology. Anyway, I don't think anyone can say any religion is "right" or "wrong." Every group will think their culture is the best when things are going well for them-- it's a natural way for humans to think. There is no way to solve any debate of this nature, and to debate it further only destroys relationships when all most people want is peace. Very true. From what I've been taught, Christians do not worship Jesus, his crucifixion metaphorically provides a bridge between us and God so that we can pray to him. The Bible has been altered somewhat through translation, however, the jist of the Bible still exists.
I'll address what both you you said. To Scraps 2-point-0, regarding your explanation which you back with the sciences of physics & biology...they may be changing, but let me ask you this: Where do Laws come from (ex-Any Laws such as Laws of thermodynamics, matter, motion, energy, etc...)? All Laws must have a Law-Maker. Something cannot exist from nothing. Most people say that the big bang theory proves otherwise, but where would that mass that exploded have come from? The answer is clearly not that it is simply random because if everything is random then the world wouldn't exist because randomness does not follow a trend as it surely have for humanity & such related things. & as for the argument you have for cultures favoring their religion when times are best, that isn't true either. Many people have been through very difficult times & who was there for them? God (or in Arabic, Allah) was because they trusted in Him (even if they didn't He answers whoever He so wishes to help, for He knows best). & not all debate destroys relationships because without debating, nothing would ever change for the better nor would anyone learn to understand anything (or think for themselves). Peace is perfection which humans are not. There will never be full peace, but we can all do the best we can & never give up (just keep in mind that humans have weaknesses they are prone to follow since we were made that way & have to work with what we have, make the best of it). It's about having good intentions, at the very least.
To Celestial_Mana, You're correct, but also incorrect because Christians believe (I've studied so I do know what I'm talking about, no worries there) that he is the bridge to God, but also they believe he IS God as well. What I will say is, why would we need a bridge to God if He can hear all, & knows all that ever has been or will be? The answer is clearly, we do not need a bridge. We speak directly to Him. He knows everything & always will therefore there is no need for any link (which also hits on the fact that there is no need for confession which is practiced in some sects of Christianity). Also, if Jesus was to be the bridge to God, how would that make any sense if he is also God? The son & the Father cannot be one for that would not make cognitive sense to any able-minded human being. & one cannot be the bring to the same one because that's repetitive & confusing. God sent messages to various prophets that were with clear meanings that should not confuse those who are to follow Him since we need Him. Allah (the One, True God) is perfect & has no need for complexities like those. He is One, the only thing that makes any sense.
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Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2010 4:45 am
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Saddest Shade of Kitsune Celestial_Mana Scraps 2-point-0 I was raised Jewish, but I've become something of an atheistic-spiritualist myself. I believe there are forces out there we as humans can't understand, but they are only higher powers, and not a higher consciousness-- that is, I don't think there is any deity that can be personified. I think reincarnation may exist just because of the constant exchange of forces in physics and biology. Anyway, I don't think anyone can say any religion is "right" or "wrong." Every group will think their culture is the best when things are going well for them-- it's a natural way for humans to think. There is no way to solve any debate of this nature, and to debate it further only destroys relationships when all most people want is peace. Very true. From what I've been taught, Christians do not worship Jesus, his crucifixion metaphorically provides a bridge between us and God so that we can pray to him. The Bible has been altered somewhat through translation, however, the jist of the Bible still exists. I'll address what both you you said. To Scraps 2-point-0, regarding your explanation which you back with the sciences of physics & biology...they may be changing, but let me ask you this: Where do Laws come from (ex-Any Laws such as Laws of thermodynamics, matter, motion, energy, etc...)? All Laws must have a Law-Maker. Something cannot exist from nothing. Most people say that the big bang theory proves otherwise, but where would that mass that exploded have come from? The answer is clearly not that it is simply random because if everything is random then the world wouldn't exist because randomness does not follow a trend as it surely have for humanity & such related things. & as for the argument you have for cultures favoring their religion when times are best, that isn't true either. Many people have been through very difficult times & who was there for them? God (or in Arabic, Allah) was because they trusted in Him (even if they didn't He answers whoever He so wishes to help, for He knows best). & not all debate destroys relationships because without debating, nothing would ever change for the better nor would anyone learn to understand anything (or think for themselves). Peace is perfection which humans are not. There will never be full peace, but we can all do the best we can & never give up (just keep in mind that humans have weaknesses they are prone to follow since we were made that way & have to work with what we have, make the best of it). It's about having good intentions, at the very least.
To Celestial_Mana, You're correct, but also incorrect because Christians believe (I've studied so I do know what I'm talking about, no worries there) that he is the bridge to God, but also they believe he IS God as well. What I will say is, why would we need a bridge to God if He can hear all, & knows all that ever has been or will be? The answer is clearly, we do not need a bridge. We speak directly to Him. He knows everything & always will therefore there is no need for any link (which also hits on the fact that there is no need for confession which is practiced in some sects of Christianity). Also, if Jesus was to be the bridge to God, how would that make any sense if he is also God? The son & the Father cannot be one for that would not make cognitive sense to any able-minded human being. & one cannot be the bring to the same one because that's repetitive & confusing. God sent messages to various prophets that were with clear meanings that should not confuse those who are to follow Him since we need Him. Allah (the One, True God) is perfect & has no need for complexities like those. He is One, the only thing that makes any sense. I admit, the translations of the Bible have made certain concepts confusing and difficult to comprehend, however, the main purpose and gist of the Bible remains intact. The main purpose of Jesus was to be an example of what we should aspire to be. We would need a bridge because we are imperfect, sinful beings. The bridge is metaphorical, it is living by Jesus' example and communication with God that we are able to be closer with him.
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Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2010 10:46 am
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@celestial, there is a very big different between Christianity & Islam that I'll address that definitely accounts for our disagreement. In Christianity, with the Adam & Eve story, when Eve ate the forbidden fruit, God cast them from the Garden & didn't forgive them for that sin, which is why Jesus was sacrificed, to save all of mankind. In Islam, first of all, BOTH of them ate the fruit (which clears up the issue of women being more sinful/bad as seen in many sects) & when they were cast from the Garden Allah (One & Only God) forgave them because they asked for forgiveness & Allah always forgives those who repent. There is no need for a savior or an intermediate. There is no need for the metaphorical bridge because although humans are created weak, Allah & we have a direct relationship because we are His creation & He is our Creator. & we do believe in following the example of the various prophets who Allah sent His Message to (Jesus being one of them, as well as Ibrahim [Abraham], Musa [Moses], & Muhammad), but one is not held above all the rest (though Muhammad was the last prophet & since we believe he received the final message [The Holy Qu'ran], he can provide the best example, though not considered above the others since he is merely human as well). For Muslims, we get closer to Allah (God) by praying, worshiping Him in various ways, & doing our best to keep on the Deen (the way/the path).
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Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2010 11:02 am
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