Pan got back to me

[mamarita]

Here's how he said we will get updates on the rest of the proposal

Everything will be posted in the SC Forums... Right............

And here is what I sent to him in response.. very appropriate I believe

I appreciate you letting all of Gaia know about the updates, but I think that anything pertaining to the proposal, WE should get a little heads up on. After all, WE are the ones that initiated something specific. WE put a lot of the time and effort into exactly what the guilds need and want and WE took the time and effort to specifically work with the developers for the last couple of years on guild needed enhancements. Please give us a little heads up before it heads to the rest of Gaia.  

[Amensu Saje]

mamarita

It sounds very appropriate to me. I agree 100%.

On an off-topic note, I really hope they fix the link on the Gaia Homepage soon (for the Spotlight). I own the Spotlighted guild and would really like them to hurry and fix that so that I can get the publicity for The Elite AT. 3nodding  

[Pilotslover]

Fully agreed though I doubt Pan will.

Despite the fact we did most of the work, the devs will never give us the effort back.  

[Psalm Grasshopper]

That seems a bit unnecessary to me. Why use such a strong tone over something so trivial? It doesn't really matter if we see it before the rest of Gaia. It's updated, and that's what everyone wanted, right?  

[Amensu Saje]

Psalm Grasshopper

That seems a bit unnecessary to me. Why use such a strong tone over something so trivial? It doesn't really matter if we see it before the rest of Gaia. It's updated, and that's what everyone wanted, right?

Is that what we wanted? Yes. However, it's only fair if they talk directly with those who made it happen. Yes, they're the ones working on it. But there's still the fact that they never would have done it if it hadn't been for us bringing it up and pushing for it for so long. It's only fair that they talk directly with us and then go on to tell the rest of Gaia. They should make an effort to personally keep us updated on the updates.  

[Psalm Grasshopper]

Well, he said that we will get updates on the proposal posted in the SC Forums. Mamarita's response just struck me as... well, rude. Over the top. She could have phrased it a bit differently, instead of the way she did. It made it sound like we're entitled to get a head's up before everyone else, and that they (the developers, panagramic, powers-that-be, etc) are being rude for not informing us first. Yeah, we did push them to do it, but now that it's being done, is it really relevant who gets to see the updates first?

Having a sneak peak on the updates doesn't really do anything. They're showing us that our suggestions are valuable by actually doing them.  

[Pilotslover]

Psalm Grasshopper

Well, he said that we will get updates on the proposal posted in the SC Forums. Mamarita's response just struck me as... well, rude. Over the top. She could have phrased it a bit differently, instead of the way she did. It made it sound like we're entitled to get a head's up before everyone else, and that they (the developers, panagramic, powers-that-be, etc) are being rude for not informing us first. Yeah, we did push them to do it, but now that it's being done, is it really relevant who gets to see the updates first?

Having a sneak peak on the updates doesn't really do anything. They're showing us that our suggestions are valuable by actually doing them.

A heads up is not a preview ...

They're two different things. Rita is asking to be made aware when something new is about to come out and since we worked so hard to get these things to happen I think it's only fair that one of the devs has the decency just to stop by and let us know that soon we'll get 'insert thing here' on 'insert date here'.

It's not about seeing it before anyone else, it's about letting us know that they're actually doing something (For a change ...).  

[Pilotslover]

LollyxBeans

While I agree that it would be nice to get a little bit of a heads up, I have to agree with Psalm. The tone of the message is entitled, and makes it seem like we did more work than there actually was. It's not like any of us are doing any of the coding, which is where the real meat of the work lies, in my opinion. Not that I'm downplaying the effort it took to get these changes started, and made. It's just...

If I were a programmer who had just busted my hump coding up something for this, and then I received a message like that, I would feel...well, rather upset that my hard work had been brushed off with an admonishment that I didn't inform a certain group of people. There wasn't even really a mention of thanks in that message, unless there was something she left out.
Because really, I think I would feel that my time and effort spent working with the outdated codes of the guilds is worth more than...that.

It all seems a bit...unappreciative. They actually did some work. Why deter them by being, well, rude?
Asking for updates is one thing. Demanding them is another. :

I didn't read it that way at all.

I read it more as 'look, Pan, when it comes to ideas we suggested it'd be nice if you just dropped by to let us know you were working on them'.

Effectively we did the leg work for Gaia as a guild, we pulled together the desirable ideas for them and presented them in a neat, organised fashion, the alternative to which would have been a thread in either GCD or SF that would have quickly grown too big and the ideas would have been lost.

A little appreciation for the work we've done would be nice.

No one's denying that coding is hard work but it does feel a little like Gaia is using us for ideas and taking the credit. sweatdrop

It's taken them years to even start this work (A few false starts along the way too!) yet in a few threads here the Dev's have admitted to never thinking of very basic ideas (This is why devs should spend a little time in the places they're about to work on I think!).

I'd be nice to be acknowledged, you know?  

[Amensu Saje]

I see where everybody's coming from. I do, however, have to say that I'm still with mamarita and Pilotslover on this one.  

[Tantooden]

Uhm...Being honest.

1.- The note is right. But think that there should be a thank you and please in every petition and much more important in this kind of stuff.

2.- If I do not recall bad, Pan, has already gave us a head ups about the future projects in guild features. Personally, I think that now-a-days devs are very busy to deliver every same info to each part.
Other case would be, if we were a test, marketplace "focus" group, but we are just ideas generators, so if we have it here or there doesn't matter, that much.

"Could someone tell me, what CS stand for?"  

[Pilotslover]

nanieru

Uhm...Being honest.

1.- The note is right. But think that there should be a thank you and please in every petition and much more important in this kind of stuff.

2.- If I do not recall bad, Pan, has already gave us a head ups about the future projects in guild features. Personally, I think that now-a-days devs are very busy to deliver every same info to each part.
Other case would be, if we were a test, marketplace "focus" group, but we are just ideas generators, so if we have it here or there doesn't matter, that much.

"Could someone tell me, what CS stand for?"

Idea generators get paid in real life, a little heads up isn't too much to ask.

I believe CS stands for Cash Shop.  

[Tantooden]

Pilotslover

Idea generators get paid in real life, a little heads up isn't too much to ask.

I believe CS stands for Cash Shop.

True. but in this case were we the ones whom push to have an update...The simply fact of being heard now-a-days is more than a reward for many.
And we had an heads up, remember?

http://www.gaiaonline.com/guilds/viewtopic.php?page=9&t=21144457#309000677

If you read between lines, you know which are going to pass and which not.

??? And there is a Cash shop forum 0~o??
*goes to search*  

[Pilotslover]

nanieru

True. but in this case were we the ones whom push to have an update...The simply fact of being heard now-a-days is more than a reward for many.
And we had an heads up, remember?

http://www.gaiaonline.com/guilds/viewtopic.php?page=9&t=21144457#309000677

If you read between lines, you know which are going to pass and which not.

??? And there is a Cash shop forum 0~o??
*goes to search*

That's not what Rita is referring too, it's more ... Pan just stopping by to let us know something we suggested is being worked on; right now he's going half the job (Getting us to come up with the ideas but not keeping us up to date).

The fact we had to push for an update looks worse for the guilds devs rather then better ... sweatdrop