I Regret Holding My Tongue. (SPOILER)

[Syndactyly]

Concerning this week's chapter.

Damn! So I argued with a lot of people about Shikamaru's smoking. I picked an idea and stuck with it. Because it made more sense to me. I regret not going with my initial gut feeling. I've been reading books about "Journeys of Souls" and "Life After Death." I initially believe the cigarette was a totem, and hell, I was right. Too bad I decided to go with the more logical reason instead.

The cigarette isn't keeping Asuma alive nor is it a sign of respect. Nor is it a nasty habit.

It's a token, or talisman. Anyone who reads Shaman King knows what I'm talking about. I had no idea that Shikamaru believed in such concepts; perhaps he's a Buddhist, or maybe he's just so bummed about this that he's resorting to spiritual concepts.

So anyways, that was my first thought. That Shikamaru felt immediately spiritually connected to Asuma. And don't any of you say you said that; I know no one said that. I didn't say anything here because I thought it would be too mushy. My mom thought it was a cool idea, though xd (She's into New Age concepts). Boy, was I close!

So then everyone argued that Shikamaru wasn't throwing a fit or upset or being reckless. Tsunade agreed with me... I saw this from a experienced point of view, not a child's point of view. For Shikamaru to leave Konoha after Asuma's killers is ridiculous. With Kakashi, it's still ridiculous.

Your thoughts? Also, don't come in here and argue with each other. I'm not planning on arguing, so that's not a problem.

Lastly, don't say this is an excuse taking back what I said. No, I also believed what I said was true. Now I'm pretty sure I was wrong. But one does not negate the other. They both existed equally in my mind, but I was too embarrassed (and considered it taboo) to bring up such concepts.  

[Captain Verd]

And I quote the chapter: "Asuma's with us". But he's not keeping him alive, no.  

[Syndactyly]

Captain Verd

And I quote the chapter: "Asuma's with us". But he's not keeping him alive, no.

TOTEM. Are you dense or do you just not know the meaning of the word? gonk I would like to say it's the latter.

(I'm not talking about the Totem on Wikipedia. What I'm talking about doesn't have an English word; Totem is the closest thing. Talisman would be closer, though.)  

[Captain Verd]

A totem is an emblem reminding someone or a family of its ancestry, or an object that can define a clan or family. The cigarettes remind Shikamaru of Asuma, but I believe he's talking about more when he says "Asuma's with us", as if to say he's always watching over them. As if to say Asuma will always be with us in spirit, as in he's still alive in each of us.  

[Syndactyly]

Shikamaru said that they were being protected. Simply a memory does not do this.

Your beliefs are solely an opinion. confused They have no bearing over mine, nor anyone else's. Shikamaru was being quite literal. Not in the sense you're drawing out of context. But whatever. Think what you will.  

[Captain Verd]

Shikamaru also says that he won't stop smoking until the thing with Kakuzu and Hidan is settled. Why? Not because they're a "totem" for Asuma, but because if Shikamaru smoking Asuma's cigs finishes the mission Asuma set out to do, it's a victory for Asuma. He's keeping him alive so he can finish off what his teacher set out to do, and then he'll let him move on. He has to keep Asuma alive and with them until the mission is over.  

[Syndactyly]

Captain Verd

Shikamaru also says that he won't stop smoking until the thing with Kakuzu and Hidan is settled. Why? Not because they're a "totem" for Asuma, but because if Shikamaru smoking Asuma's cigs finishes the mission Asuma set out to do, it's a victory for Asuma. He's keeping him alive so he can finish off what his teacher set out to do, and then he'll let him move on. He has to keep Asuma alive and with them until the mission is over.

That is simply your point of view.

A talisman is no longer needed when it's spirit has been put to rest. Asuma's "protection" (which is realistically just Shikamaru's belief, and is not really occurring) only ends because his talisman has lost it's power. It lost it's power because it was only temporary. To say, "Asuma is with us" in the context of which you stated it implies that is lasts forever. This simply isn't the case.

Shikamaru is not keeping a ghost alive. Why can't you give that up? Spiritual summoning and, "keeping one's essence alive" are two very different things. Ghosts are dead. Dead is dead. Keeping him alive is not keeping him dead. Shikamaru isn't holding Asuma against his will. A spirit channels into a talisman by their own choice.

Shikamaru does not have to do anything.  

[Captain Verd]

Asuma isn't helping them by his own will. He's not actually embodying the cigarettes from his grave, watching over the little kiddos until they get the job done.

Lolz, I'm not going to give it a rest, because I'm right. There is no real talisman or totem or whatever you call it there. The cigs embody the spirit of Asuma in a very metaphorical sense. Shikamaru needs to smoke them, because he needs Asuma to see the end of the battle in a victory. That's the only way he can let Asuma go and not feel guilty for the rest of his life.  

[churrlo]

Shikalee, I am not entirely sure what you mean in your first post... sweatdrop  

[nintendonerd]

You're kinda both wrong, he says it in the chapter.
"This keepsake of tobacco...the smoke reminds me of asuma it seems to be protecting us..."
Which obviously means that Shikimaru just wants his memory to be with them.  

[churrlo]

Interesting  

[~Kira Hime~]

The views on Shika smoking are really different...as they were when he first started smoking.

The totem idea is intresting, but I tihnk that he's still just doing it to keep Asuma's memory.

 

[Syndactyly]

nintendonerd

You're kinda both wrong, he says it in the chapter.
"This keepsake of tobacco...the smoke reminds me of asuma it seems to be protecting us..."
Which obviously means that Shikimaru just wants his memory to be with them.

You took the segment out. Which changes the meaning of the sentence... "The smoke reminds me of Asuma. It seems to be protecting us."  

[Mist-san]

From what I understand of the chapter, I think that Shikamaru is smoking to keep Asuma's memory alive. I dont think that Asuma's ghost will come out of no where or whatever you guys were getting at. I feel that Shikamaru is smoking just because if he smells the smoke, he would fell that Asuma is there, and that in itself will give him the strenght to 'finish the job' so to speak. Just my pov though

let Verd and Shikalee start their flames at me.  

[churrlo]

Um... no idea what to say ninja