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 Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 7:31 am
I said this once and I'm going to say it millions of times, those suicide bombings guys are so silly, I don't even understand why they do it , it's not going to do anything but let people think that muslim people are people who love to kill! When they do it in the name of islam, it's then something that might be related to Islam. No, it's not. There are certain rules in Islam about war, but people don't follow it. When People don't follow it ( The rules ), it doesn't mean that it doesn't exisit! You want blame someone, blame those people! But please don't blame Islam and Allah, because they didn't say anything about suicide bombings! I personally think that war is the last resort! And we shouldn't follow it unless it's an extreme need!
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Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 9:36 am
Mini_Angel_1994 I said this once and I'm going to say it millions of times, those suicide bombings guys are so silly, I don't even understand why they do it , it's not going to do anything but let people think that muslim people are people who love to kill! When they do it in the name of islam, it's then something that might be related to Islam. No, it's not. There are certain rules in Islam about war, but people don't follow it. When People don't follow it ( The rules ), it doesn't mean that it doesn't exisit! You want blame someone, blame those people! But please don't blame Islam and Allah, because they didn't say anything about suicide bombings! I personally think that war is the last resort! And we shouldn't follow it unless it's an extreme need!
Religion is mankind's creation to cope with the world. It's a flawed concept, so I'm not surprised that such things happen with mangling a scriptural text.
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Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 10:23 am
Absurd, we have our own belive, and u can have your own!
And it's the atackers fould anyways...
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Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 2:35 pm
Zaaki Absurd, we have our own belive, and u can have your own! And it's the atackers fould anyways...
yeah, "Muslims" that blow up their own children and say that they are doing God's work and saying that they are righteous and everyone else is wrong.
That is one of many beliefs I will not support and it seems like that majority silence of Muslims supports that concept.
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Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 3:11 pm
Absurd Thought Zaaki Absurd, we have our own belive, and u can have your own! And it's the atackers fould anyways...
yeah, "Muslims" that blow up their own children and say that they are doing God's work and saying that they are righteous and everyone else is wrong.
That is one of many beliefs I will not support and it seems like that majority silence of Muslims supports that concept. Where does it say in the Qur'an that killing your children and saying it's God work come into play? (Note: Don't show me Sunnah/Hadiths, Because I believe them to be Fabricated.) The only thing I can think of that has you killing your own Child was the story of Abraham as a Test, That's about it. If you cannot provide proof or maybe you have a misunderstanding in a Verse, Then you are most likely looking at Arabs who claim to be Muslims, But can't even follow what they are obligated to do. (5 pillars of Islam)
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Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 7:04 pm
Haydar the Truthful Absurd Thought Zaaki Absurd, we have our own belive, and u can have your own! And it's the atackers fould anyways...
yeah, "Muslims" that blow up their own children and say that they are doing God's work and saying that they are righteous and everyone else is wrong.
That is one of many beliefs I will not support and it seems like that majority silence of Muslims supports that concept. Where does it say in the Qur'an that killing your children and saying it's God work come into play? (Note: Don't show me Sunnah/Hadiths, Because I believe them to be Fabricated.) The only thing I can think of that has you killing your own Child was the story of Abraham as a Test, That's about it. If you cannot provide proof or maybe you have a misunderstanding in a Verse, Then you are most likely looking at Arabs who claim to be Muslims, But can't even follow what they are obligated to do. (5 pillars of Islam)
Notice how I said "Muslims" and not Muslims.
I'm not so cynical about religion that I don't know the difference between fundamentalists and regular religious people.
And it's not just Arabs, it's people from all nationalities, including Pakistanis, Chinese, and much more.
I'm going to pick out some quotes from the Koran. These quotes are from a site recommended by Phoenixia when discussing Koran texts with ratri. I figure it would be good to use a site recommended by a Muslim...Quote: 4:75 Let those then fight in the cause of Allah who would sell the present life for the Hereafter. And whoso fights in the cause of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious, We shall soon give him a great reward. Quote: [4:95] O ye who believe! when you go forth to fight in the cause of Allah, make proper investigation and say not to anyone who greets you with the greeting of peace, Thou art not a believer.' You seek the goods of this life, but with Allah are good things in plenty. Such were you before this, but Allah conferred His special favour on you; so do make proper investigation. Surely, Allah is Aware of what you do. [4:96] Those of the believers who sit at home, excepting the disabled ones, and those who strive in the cause of Allah with their wealth and their persons, are not equal. Allah has exalted in rank those who strive with their wealth and their persons above those who sit at home. And to each Allah has promised good. And Allah has exalted those who strive above those who sit at home, by a great reward -
I don't plan to say, well the text reads this...
Its easy to see how quickly this could get mangled.
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Posted: Thu Oct 23, 2008 9:23 am
Absurd Thought Mini_Angel_1994 I said this once and I'm going to say it millions of times, those suicide bombings guys are so silly, I don't even understand why they do it , it's not going to do anything but let people think that muslim people are people who love to kill! When they do it in the name of islam, it's then something that might be related to Islam. No, it's not. There are certain rules in Islam about war, but people don't follow it. When People don't follow it ( The rules ), it doesn't mean that it doesn't exisit! You want blame someone, blame those people! But please don't blame Islam and Allah, because they didn't say anything about suicide bombings! I personally think that war is the last resort! And we shouldn't follow it unless it's an extreme need!
Religion is mankind's creation to cope with the world. It's a flawed concept, so I'm not surprised that such things happen with mangling a scriptural text.So, you're saying that a religon is something we made up?? I can't follow up with you.
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Posted: Thu Oct 23, 2008 9:42 am
Mini_Angel_1994 Absurd Thought Mini_Angel_1994 I said this once and I'm going to say it millions of times, those suicide bombings guys are so silly, I don't even understand why they do it , it's not going to do anything but let people think that muslim people are people who love to kill! When they do it in the name of islam, it's then something that might be related to Islam. No, it's not. There are certain rules in Islam about war, but people don't follow it. When People don't follow it ( The rules ), it doesn't mean that it doesn't exisit! You want blame someone, blame those people! But please don't blame Islam and Allah, because they didn't say anything about suicide bombings! I personally think that war is the last resort! And we shouldn't follow it unless it's an extreme need!
Religion is mankind's creation to cope with the world. It's a flawed concept, so I'm not surprised that such things happen with mangling a scriptural text.So, you're saying that a religon is something we made up?? I can't follow up with you.
Yeah...well if it was truly created by some divine being, I would think that a religion would
a) be less hostile to everyone else, and the being would interfere in holy wars
b)people would actually follow all bits of the faith, to its truest form, and there would be warnings, and everyone would know who was falling away and the being would actually care and make physical attempts to bring the person back to the faith
c) there wouldn't be abusers of the faith
Abraham=Judaism
Christianity=Jesus
Islam=Muhammad
That's my perspective. I don't believe in a god. or gods, nor see the need to do so.
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Posted: Thu Oct 23, 2008 10:08 am
Ok, so you don't believe in any God, and you think this whole universe came by coincidence. ( I've met many people like you )
So, let us take an example. When you take a bucket of white paint, and you throw it on the wall, the chances of getting a picture like: a foot print for example, are high right? BUT! When you take a bucket of mixture of colours, and throw it on the wall, you might get a rainbow of colours scattered everywhere. BUT!! What are the chances of getting Monalisa? The chances are so low that it's almost impossible!
The same thing goes for this universe, The skies so high, the floor so solid, the gravity, the sun is in the proper distance, could this be by coincedence? Can you throw a bunch of planets, and those planets bumped into each other, and made this Monalisa ?
Think about it.
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Posted: Thu Oct 23, 2008 11:15 am
Mini_Angel_1994 Ok, so you don't believe in any God, and you think this whole universe came by coincidence. ( I've met many people like you ) So, let us take an example. When you take a bucket of white paint, and you throw it on the wall, the chances of getting a picture like: a foot print for example, are high right? BUT! When you take a bucket of mixture of colours, and throw it on the wall, you might get a rainbow of colours scattered everywhere. BUT!! What are the chances of getting Monalisa? The chances are so low that it's almost impossible! The same thing goes for this universe, The skies so high, the floor so solid, the gravity, the sun is in the proper distance, could this be by coincedence? Can you throw a bunch of planets, and those planets bumped into each other, and made this Monalisa ? Think about it. Firstly the Monalisa concept i get it it pretty much makes sense but to other thing you said about the planets; that is because of attractive and repulsive forces between masses.
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Posted: Thu Oct 23, 2008 11:53 am
Ok Tassan, where did these attractive and repulsive forces come from? Did it come out of blew? Who came up with such idea?? I don't think it's something made by the nothingness!! I don't know, it doesn't make any sense..
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Posted: Thu Oct 23, 2008 12:53 pm
Mini_Angel_1994 Ok, so you don't believe in any God, and you think this whole universe came by coincidence. ( I've met many people like you ) So, let us take an example. When you take a bucket of white paint, and you throw it on the wall, the chances of getting a picture like: a foot print for example, are high right? BUT! When you take a bucket of mixture of colours, and throw it on the wall, you might get a rainbow of colours scattered everywhere. BUT!! What are the chances of getting Monalisa? The chances are so low that it's almost impossible! The same thing goes for this universe, The skies so high, the floor so solid, the gravity, the sun is in the proper distance, could this be by coincedence? Can you throw a bunch of planets, and those planets bumped into each other, and made this Monalisa ? Think about it.
The correct amount of ions, positive and negative attraction would make this possible. Without it, there would be no universe. Your body would not function, without the very basic elements, rocks would not be solid, and atmosphere would not form.
Gravity is a big part of it as well. So are electromagnetic forces.
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Posted: Thu Oct 23, 2008 2:13 pm
Absurd Thought Mini_Angel_1994 Ok, so you don't believe in any God, and you think this whole universe came by coincidence. ( I've met many people like you ) So, let us take an example. When you take a bucket of white paint, and you throw it on the wall, the chances of getting a picture like: a foot print for example, are high right? BUT! When you take a bucket of mixture of colours, and throw it on the wall, you might get a rainbow of colours scattered everywhere. BUT!! What are the chances of getting Monalisa? The chances are so low that it's almost impossible! The same thing goes for this universe, The skies so high, the floor so solid, the gravity, the sun is in the proper distance, could this be by coincedence? Can you throw a bunch of planets, and those planets bumped into each other, and made this Monalisa ? Think about it.
The correct amount of ions, positive and negative attraction would make this possible. Without it, there would be no universe. Your body would not function, without the very basic elements, rocks would not be solid, and atmosphere would not form.
Gravity is a big part of it as well. So are electromagnetic forces.
Ok, you're telling me facts, who adjusted this correct amount of ions, who came up with the postive and negative attraction idea? Can you imagine it? You're telling me the exact same facts that should make you wonder, who did all of this! It's not something simple!
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Posted: Thu Oct 23, 2008 2:36 pm
Absurd Thought
Notice how I said "Muslims" and not Muslims.
I'm not so cynical about religion that I don't know the difference between fundamentalists and regular religious people.
And it's not just Arabs, it's people from all nationalities, including Pakistanis, Chinese, and much more.
I'm going to pick out some quotes from the Koran. These quotes are from a site recommended by Phoenixia when discussing Koran texts with ratri. I figure it would be good to use a site recommended by a Muslim...Quote: 4:75 Let those then fight in the cause of Allah who would sell the present life for the Hereafter. And whoso fights in the cause of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious, We shall soon give him a great reward. Quote: [4:95] O ye who believe! when you go forth to fight in the cause of Allah, make proper investigation and say not to anyone who greets you with the greeting of peace, Thou art not a believer.' You seek the goods of this life, but with Allah are good things in plenty. Such were you before this, but Allah conferred His special favour on you; so do make proper investigation. Surely, Allah is Aware of what you do. [4:96] Those of the believers who sit at home, excepting the disabled ones, and those who strive in the cause of Allah with their wealth and their persons, are not equal. Allah has exalted in rank those who strive with their wealth and their persons above those who sit at home. And to each Allah has promised good. And Allah has exalted those who strive above those who sit at home, by a great reward -
I don't plan to say, well the text reads this...
Its easy to see how quickly this could get mangled. Oh, Sorry about the "Muslim" Concept, Thanks for clearing it up for me. You sure that first quote is correct on [4:75]? Because I have this quote in that place: Quote: "4.75": And what reason have you that you should not fight in the way of Allah and of the weak among the men and the women and the children, (of) those who say: Our Lord! cause us to go forth from this town, whose people are oppressors, and give us from Thee a guardian and give us from Thee a helper. Edit: Ah I see the mistake, You didn't get the exact verse right so I didn't see that. As far as your first quote goes regardless, From how I have come to interpret it, Basically tells that A Believing Muslim who leaves Material possessions of this world, and Fights (It's not always Literal Jihad, It can also mean the stronger jihad of fighting against Doing bad deeds, Such as Killing a innocent person, Stealing, Kidnapping innocent persons. Etc.) for the afterlife (Heaven). As for your second Quote "4.95" It simply says not to be rude when someone greets you in terms of "You are a disbeliever", Also that there are goods with Allah (God) that should suffice you instead of other things. The third one, "4.96" says those who are disabled or unable to leave their homes for normal activities and the like are excused. But those who are able to "fight" (May mean outer Jihad or inner jihad, Not always meaning to go physically fight someone, and as far as I can tell it'd be Inner Jihad simply because it's more important than outer.), Then afterwords the ones who leave their home to do as such are above the persons who stay at home and are able to do the same. Where does it say to Murder your own children?
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Posted: Thu Oct 23, 2008 3:27 pm
Haydar the Truthful Absurd Thought
Notice how I said "Muslims" and not Muslims.
I'm not so cynical about religion that I don't know the difference between fundamentalists and regular religious people.
And it's not just Arabs, it's people from all nationalities, including Pakistanis, Chinese, and much more.
I'm going to pick out some quotes from the Koran. These quotes are from a site recommended by Phoenixia when discussing Koran texts with ratri. I figure it would be good to use a site recommended by a Muslim...Quote: 4:75 Let those then fight in the cause of Allah who would sell the present life for the Hereafter. And whoso fights in the cause of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious, We shall soon give him a great reward. Quote: [4:95] O ye who believe! when you go forth to fight in the cause of Allah, make proper investigation and say not to anyone who greets you with the greeting of peace, Thou art not a believer.' You seek the goods of this life, but with Allah are good things in plenty. Such were you before this, but Allah conferred His special favour on you; so do make proper investigation. Surely, Allah is Aware of what you do. [4:96] Those of the believers who sit at home, excepting the disabled ones, and those who strive in the cause of Allah with their wealth and their persons, are not equal. Allah has exalted in rank those who strive with their wealth and their persons above those who sit at home. And to each Allah has promised good. And Allah has exalted those who strive above those who sit at home, by a great reward -
I don't plan to say, well the text reads this...
Its easy to see how quickly this could get mangled. Oh, Sorry about the "Muslim" Concept, Thanks for clearing it up for me. You sure that first quote is correct on [4:75]? Because I have this quote in that place: Quote: "4.75": And what reason have you that you should not fight in the way of Allah and of the weak among the men and the women and the children, (of) those who say: Our Lord! cause us to go forth from this town, whose people are oppressors, and give us from Thee a guardian and give us from Thee a helper. Edit: Ah I see the mistake, You didn't get the exact verse right so I didn't see that. As far as your first quote goes regardless, From how I have come to interpret it, Basically tells that A Believing Muslim who leaves Material possessions of this world, and Fights (It's not always Literal Jihad, It can also mean the stronger jihad of fighting against Doing bad deeds, Such as Killing a innocent person, Stealing, Kidnapping innocent persons. Etc.) for the afterlife (Heaven). As for your second Quote "4.95" It simply says not to be rude when someone greets you in terms of "You are a disbeliever", Also that there are goods with Allah (God) that should suffice you instead of other things. The third one, "4.96" says those who are disabled or unable to leave their homes for normal activities and the like are excused. But those who are able to "fight" (May mean outer Jihad or inner jihad, Not always meaning to go physically fight someone, and as far as I can tell it'd be Inner Jihad simply because it's more important than outer.), Then afterwords the ones who leave their home to do as such are above the persons who stay at home and are able to do the same. Where does it say to Murder your own children?
Not clinging to your material things, including children I took this site from Ratri's post and thought it was applicible here
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