James' Weekly Youth Group Lesson

[DOVE_SAVED_BY_GRACE]

Now, one of the arguments against capital punishment is one of the Ten Commandments: thou shall not kill. However, the word 'kill' actually means 'to murder WITHOUT CAUSE.' Or, in other words, in cold blood.
In Genesis 9:6, it is stated, “Whoever sheds the blood of man, by man shall his blood be shed; for in the image of God has God made man.” I talked to my pastor about this. I interpret this to mean that if someone kills someone else, the killer should be killed for killing that made in God's image by God. My pastor said that killers should be killed, but only by the government, with the government's authority, under the authority's laws, and that the power to carry out the execution lies not with any individual, but with the government.

The Catechism of the Catholic Church states:
Assuming that the guilty party's identity and responsibility have been fully determined, the traditional teaching of the Church does not exclude recourse to the death penalty, if this is the only possible way of effectively defending human lives against the unjust aggressor. If, however, nonlethal means are sufficient to defend and protect people's safety from the aggressor, authority will limit itself to such means, as these are more in keeping with the concrete conditions of the common good and are more in conformity to the dignity of the human person. Today, in fact, as a consequence of the possibilities which the state has for effectively preventing crime, by rendering one who has committed an offense incapable of doing harm - without definitely taking away from him the possibility of redeeming himself - the cases in which the execution of the offender is an absolute necessity are very rare, if not practically nonexistent

In 2000 the Southern Baptist Convention updated Baptist Faith and Message. In it the convention officially sanctioned the use of capital punishment by the State. It said that it is the duty of the state to execute those guilty of murder and that God established capital punishment in the Noahic Covenant.


Well, that's it.
Feel free to discuss, but please, be respectful of each other.  

[Beth Turner]

What exactly is said in the Noahic Covenant? (Have you looked the whole thing up?)
Also, something to think about:
Genesis 9:6: “Whoever sheds the blood of man, by man shall his blood be shed; for in the image of God has God made man.”
It does not state in the verse below that GOD will be the one to shed that blood, or even that He condones it, merely that it is a strong probability- something likely to happen to sinners who commit this crime.
OR
If someone DOES interpret this to mean that God Himself will take action on murderers, then what are WE doing when we execute murderers if not playing God? If God says He will shed the blood of man for the sin of murder, then shouldn't we take our hands and the hands of our government OUT of God's business?
THEREFORE
It cannot be both. It is either that this is something God believes men will do on their own (like making it part of their governments, which man HAS done) or that God has taken it upon himself to personally shed the blood of murderers. If that is the case, we should not interfere in God's dealings of justice.
ALSO
In the Old Testament there were many many punishments that athiests and secularists love to throw up in the faces of Christians reguarding barbarisms such as executing homosexuals. However, we as Christians no longer execute homosexuals on the grounds that when Jesus Christ came to fulfill the Law and told us it is better to FORGIVE, that such commandments from the Old Testament were broken to allow for forgiveness, healing, love, and the blood of Christ to take their places. If murder is a sin that the Old Testament has condemned to death, shouldn't we also look at this as something the New Testament has asked us to forgive and heal through the blood of Christ? Is it not better to save a man's soul and give him a chance of redemption rather than kill him for his sins?


All these things require serious meditation and thought. What would your answers be to the questions this post presents?  

[DOVE_SAVED_BY_GRACE]

No, I did not look up the Noahic Covenant, though I should have....
My pastor told me that it is up to man to execute murderers.
Perhaps I should have done a bit more research on this.  

[Kezel]

Beth Turner

What exactly is said in the Noahic Covenant? (Have you looked the whole thing up?)
Also, something to think about:
Genesis 9:6: “Whoever sheds the blood of man, by man shall his blood be shed; for in the image of God has God made man.”
It does not state in the verse below that GOD will be the one to shed that blood, or even that He condones it, merely that it is a strong probability- something likely to happen to sinners who commit this crime.
OR
If someone DOES interpret this to mean that God Himself will take action on murderers, then what are WE doing when we execute murderers if not playing God? If God says He will shed the blood of man for the sin of murder, then shouldn't we take our hands and the hands of our government OUT of God's business?
THEREFORE
It cannot be both. It is either that this is something God believes men will do on their own (like making it part of their governments, which man HAS done) or that God has taken it upon himself to personally shed the blood of murderers. If that is the case, we should not interfere in God's dealings of justice.
ALSO
In the Old Testament there were many many punishments that athiests and secularists love to throw up in the faces of Christians reguarding barbarisms such as executing homosexuals. However, we as Christians no longer execute homosexuals on the grounds that when Jesus Christ came to fulfill the Law and told us it is better to FORGIVE, that such commandments from the Old Testament were broken to allow for forgiveness, healing, love, and the blood of Christ to take their places. If murder is a sin that the Old Testament has condemned to death, shouldn't we also look at this as something the New Testament has asked us to forgive and heal through the blood of Christ? Is it not better to save a man's soul and give him a chance of redemption rather than kill him for his sins?


All these things require serious meditation and thought. What would your answers be to the questions this post presents?

I agree with you biggrin  

[Beth Turner]

DOVE_SAVED_BY_GRACE

No, I did not look up the Noahic Covenant, though I should have....
My pastor told me that it is up to man to execute murderers.
Perhaps I should have done a bit more research on this.

Good, I'm glad I got you to think a bit. As Christians we are stereotyped as backwards country idiots who are only so because we are uneducated or superstitious. We, therefore, must be the ones to shock others with our intellect, wisdom, and knowledge of the subjects we chose to stand up for. The world is looking in to see what we do and say, just WAITING for an excuse to dismiss our claims, believes, and our God as close-minded stubborness. We above all people must be the most prepared.  

[DOVE_SAVED_BY_GRACE]

Beth Turner

DOVE_SAVED_BY_GRACE

No, I did not look up the Noahic Covenant, though I should have....
My pastor told me that it is up to man to execute murderers.
Perhaps I should have done a bit more research on this.

Good, I'm glad I got you to think a bit. As Christians we are stereotyped as backwards country idiots who are only so because we are uneducated or superstitious. We, therefore, must be the ones to shock others with our intellect, wisdom, and knowledge of the subjects we chose to stand up for. The world is looking in to see what we do and say, just WAITING for an excuse to dismiss our claims, believes, and our God as close-minded stubbornness. We above all people must be the most prepared.

Yes, I can see your point. Next time I will research more and not put a deadline on myself.  

[DOVE_SAVED_BY_GRACE]

This thread is now closed.
I'm not going to have the strength, nor the will, to continue this any more.
I will still be in the guild, of course, but I can't continue the thread.