Nazi goths? fact or fiction

[Rellik San]

I love how 'nazi' has become a way to describe a personal belief, even though it was a military organization, the term you need is either white supremest or Ayrian Supremest.  

[GilAskan]

Veruniel

Drekavac

And nazi ideology isn't really a bad thing...

Hold the phone.

How is censorship of independent thought, extermination of 'degenerate' ethnicities, subjugation of women, and coldblooded murder of people with deseases 'not a bad thing'?

You must be using some definition of 'Nazi' that I've never heard of.

What you described is under Hitler's Nazi party. There are however seperate factions of Nazism (whose official title is actually Nationalist Socialism) with varying degrees of liberality and conservativism.

National Socialism (nazism) is based around 3 main ideals: totalitarianism, jingoism (extreme nationalism, or devotion to one's country), and capitalism. Under a real national socialism, the government contains all activity within the country, but within the country, it's people are free to do as they please (within reasonable limits, of course). Essentially, a capitalism (people are free to buy and sell as they want) contained exclusively within the borders of a country.

Nazism as it's popularly known is the nazism of Hitler's Third Reich. While it's actual structure is that of national socialism, it also preached anti-Semitism, racism, homophobia, xenophobia, sexism (to a degree), and limited religious freedom. These ideals are those of Hitler's, and of many Nazi's, but not essentially of nazism in concept.  

[-Lasciate Ogni Speranza-]

Sure there are Nazi Goths. There are also Nazi Preps and Nazi Nerds, et cetera, et cetera.

Blackfoxi: While it is true that Hitler himself was obsessed with the occult (hence the presence of the Thule party at the underground of the Nazis) he was actually studying occult lore that had been around forever: he just happened to think that the only ones that were correct were anti-Semetic and refered to superior races at regular intervals.

 

[DR490N]

nazi goths? no. goths who have socialist beliefs, yes. theres a guild here on gaia called hte nazi guild, oddly enough many of the members claim to be goths. also, if you challenge their calling themselves a nazi guild and yet not hating the jews or really agreeing with any of the negative things the nazis did, you get bitched out.

honestly. if you're going to call yourself a nazi, you better ******** well believe in everything they did. it's like calling yourself a communist and yet having a belief in democracy.  

[Plan-Galere]

DR490N

nazi goths? no. goths who have socialist beliefs, yes. theres a guild here on gaia called hte nazi guild, oddly enough many of the members claim to be goths. also, if you challenge their calling themselves a nazi guild and yet not hating the jews or really agreeing with any of the negative things the nazis did, you get bitched out.

honestly. if you're going to call yourself a nazi, you better ******** well believe in everything they did. it's like calling yourself a communist and yet having a belief in democracy.

You never cease to amazing me. In the ideal of communist society, as proposed by Marx, was a FULL DEMOCRACY, where the people had all the say. You're bastardizing this view with some sort of totalitarian collectivist dictatorship or whatever you think it is.


NATIONAL SOCIALISTS, the correct word for Nazis, are not by nature racists. HITLER was a National Socialist, but he was a racist. That doesn't mean all National Socialists were anti-semites. That's like saying that all Republicans support everything that Bush does, or all Democrats believe everything that drips from Clinton or Obamas jowls.

This is the ignorant hippocrisy that stains the noble intentions of groups like this who so vehemently declare themselves "anti-label".  

[GilAskan]

miraridemon

NATIONAL SOCIALISTS, the correct word for Nazis, are not by nature racists. HITLER was a National Socialist, but he was a racist. That doesn't mean all National Socialists were anti-semites. That's like saying that all Republicans support everything that Bush does, or all Democrats believe everything that drips from Clinton or Obamas jowls.

3nodding

*Points to own post*  

[Plan-Galere]

GilAskan

miraridemon

NATIONAL SOCIALISTS, the correct word for Nazis, are not by nature racists. HITLER was a National Socialist, but he was a racist. That doesn't mean all National Socialists were anti-semites. That's like saying that all Republicans support everything that Bush does, or all Democrats believe everything that drips from Clinton or Obamas jowls.

3nodding

*Points to own post*

I call myself Authoritarian Democrat, but those are my beliefs, although in practice I'm more of a pragmatist, and do what is best. I don't call myself Nazi or fascist directly because of the negative connotations of that word.  

[GilAskan]

miraridemon

GilAskan

miraridemon

NATIONAL SOCIALISTS, the correct word for Nazis, are not by nature racists. HITLER was a National Socialist, but he was a racist. That doesn't mean all National Socialists were anti-semites. That's like saying that all Republicans support everything that Bush does, or all Democrats believe everything that drips from Clinton or Obamas jowls.

3nodding

*Points to own post*

I call myself Authoritarian Democrat, but those are my beliefs, although in practice I'm more of a pragmatist, and do what is best. I don't call myself Nazi or fascist directly because of the negative connotations of that word.

Reasonably so. The term (Nazi) has a stigma to it quite unlike any other word in the English language, save perhaps for "******".  

[Plan-Galere]

GilAskan

miraridemon

GilAskan

miraridemon

NATIONAL SOCIALISTS, the correct word for Nazis, are not by nature racists. HITLER was a National Socialist, but he was a racist. That doesn't mean all National Socialists were anti-semites. That's like saying that all Republicans support everything that Bush does, or all Democrats believe everything that drips from Clinton or Obamas jowls.

3nodding

*Points to own post*

I call myself Authoritarian Democrat, but those are my beliefs, although in practice I'm more of a pragmatist, and do what is best. I don't call myself Nazi or fascist directly because of the negative connotations of that word.

Reasonably so. The term (Nazi) has a stigma to it quite unlike any other word in the English language, save perhaps for "******".

I agree all too wholeheartedly. Ironic when such societies that prosecute claim to hold free speech high and condemn predjudice.  

[tamachan414]

miraridemon

DR490N

nazi goths? no. goths who have socialist beliefs, yes. theres a guild here on gaia called hte nazi guild, oddly enough many of the members claim to be goths. also, if you challenge their calling themselves a nazi guild and yet not hating the jews or really agreeing with any of the negative things the nazis did, you get bitched out.

honestly. if you're going to call yourself a nazi, you better ******** well believe in everything they did. it's like calling yourself a communist and yet having a belief in democracy.

You never cease to amazing me. In the ideal of communist society, as proposed by Marx, was a FULL DEMOCRACY, where the people had all the say. You're bastardizing this view with some sort of totalitarian collectivist dictatorship or whatever you think it is.


NATIONAL SOCIALISTS, the correct word for Nazis, are not by nature racists. HITLER was a National Socialist, but he was a racist. That doesn't mean all National Socialists were anti-semites. That's like saying that all Republicans support everything that Bush does, or all Democrats believe everything that drips from Clinton or Obamas jowls.

This is the ignorant hippocrisy that stains the noble intentions of groups like this who so vehemently declare themselves "anti-label".

Well Marx wouldn't be democracy, he believed that it would be a classless society with no gvt.
violent overthrow, dictatorship with farseen individuals as dictators, and then the government would wither away. sorry just studied it ^^  

[Plan-Galere]

tamachan414

miraridemon

DR490N

nazi goths? no. goths who have socialist beliefs, yes. theres a guild here on gaia called hte nazi guild, oddly enough many of the members claim to be goths. also, if you challenge their calling themselves a nazi guild and yet not hating the jews or really agreeing with any of the negative things the nazis did, you get bitched out.

honestly. if you're going to call yourself a nazi, you better ******** well believe in everything they did. it's like calling yourself a communist and yet having a belief in democracy.

You never cease to amazing me. In the ideal of communist society, as proposed by Marx, was a FULL DEMOCRACY, where the people had all the say. You're bastardizing this view with some sort of totalitarian collectivist dictatorship or whatever you think it is.


NATIONAL SOCIALISTS, the correct word for Nazis, are not by nature racists. HITLER was a National Socialist, but he was a racist. That doesn't mean all National Socialists were anti-semites. That's like saying that all Republicans support everything that Bush does, or all Democrats believe everything that drips from Clinton or Obamas jowls.

This is the ignorant hippocrisy that stains the noble intentions of groups like this who so vehemently declare themselves "anti-label".

Well Marx wouldn't be democracy, he believed that it would be a classless society with no gvt.
violent overthrow, dictatorship with farseen individuals as dictators, and then the government would wither away. sorry just studied it ^^

Marx also believed that only by pulling down the burgeoise and making them a subservient class would equality be achieved, essentially by pulling the proletariat above them. Thusly, by turning the class structure upsideown could "equality" be obtained. But this is flawed, because a society with a larger upper to lower class ratio collapses and cannot support itself. Please tell me what Marx intended to "do" with this "subservient class" in order to obtain equality? Will we follow the ways of Che Guevara and kill the upper class and their families?

Also, having a classless society is impossible lacking the presence of a government, and achieving equality by relying only on the principles of natural law is a flawed perspective. If there is no government, then it is impossible to enforce this equality, and thus, because you simple can not run society on the honour system, Marx's utopian classless society requires government, even if that is a government where every person is an active member with equal say. Thusly, if the people make the laws in a governmentless society, and decide as a whole what everything is to be, such as that everyone must get the same nessecity, then you have a democracy. Which is, of course, rule of the people.  

[Veruniel]

GilAskan

What you described is under Hitler's Nazi party. There are however seperate factions of Nazism (whose official title is actually Nationalist Socialism) with varying degrees of liberality and conservativism.

National Socialism (nazism) is based around 3 main ideals: totalitarianism, jingoism (extreme nationalism, or devotion to one's country), and capitalism. Under a real national socialism, the government contains all activity within the country, but within the country, it's people are free to do as they please (within reasonable limits, of course). Essentially, a capitalism (people are free to buy and sell as they want) contained exclusively within the borders of a country.

Nazism as it's popularly known is the nazism of Hitler's Third Reich. While it's actual structure is that of national socialism, it also preached anti-Semitism, racism, homophobia, xenophobia, sexism (to a degree), and limited religious freedom. These ideals are those of Hitler's, and of many Nazi's, but not essentially of nazism in concept.

I am aware that the word 'Nazi' is a contaction of the German words for 'National Socialism.' However, it is worth noting that Nazism and the term Nazi (as opposed to national socialism/fascism in general) are a word and a political party created by Hitler and his cronies. Anyone who describes themself as a Nazi should be aware that they'll be associated with Nazi Germany. If they want to avoid that, 'national socialist' would be a far better term to use.

In my experience, most people who call themselves Nazis claim to agree with all or most of Hitler's political beliefs, not just fascist political beliefs. And most of these people aren't aware of a lot of stuff the original Nazis were up to.

Call yourself a Nazi, and you'll be tarred with the brush that tarred Hitler.  

[Silly_Doll]

DR490N

nazi goths? no. goths who have socialist beliefs, yes. theres a guild here on gaia called hte nazi guild, oddly enough many of the members claim to be goths. also, if you challenge their calling themselves a nazi guild and yet not hating the jews or really agreeing with any of the negative things the nazis did, you get bitched out.

honestly. if you're going to call yourself a nazi, you better ******** well believe in everything they did. it's like calling yourself a communist and yet having a belief in democracy.

stare Erm... if you would read the Communist Manifesto you would know that Karl Marx... the guy who pretty much invented Communism strongly believes in democracy as the key to communism working properly. Analogy faild.

If you're talking about what STALIN's communism well... Totalitarianism has nothing to do with real communism.