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Tea, I think, can be a bit of a drama queen on occasion- and yes, I think that sometimes she does argue simply for the sake of arguing. Furthermore, she does not place a high value on candy-coated words or pulling punches, so it can get messy if you're not careful (and our friend baited the bear with her very first word wink ). Deo I have not encountered as much. I know Nuri from another guild, however, where the three are members, and I have known Nuri to pull Tea off of people and ask her to play nice. So I doubt that the three are in cahoots with each other in quite the way that you seem to be implying.

You accuse them of "trying to make it look" casual, but I don't think there's anything artificial about it. There's nothing wrong with posting your thoughts in an interesting thread, it's not unusual for certain people to show up at the same sorts of threads if they share an interest in the subject material, and if they are chatting amongst themselves about that shared interest and following each other around as interesting threads show up, so what? Why would they have to explain themselves for that, or apologize at all? That's normal use of the boards. If all they're guilty of is supporting each other's arguments and making statements with which you don't agree, well, that's not very damning. Your accusations sound a bit paranoid, honestly.^_^'

But whatever the case, in this thread they do happen to be correct. wink

*cough* I've had all three of them, Tea included... "Pull me off" of people at one point or another... Aggressively speaking... I was the more aggressive of them at one point... Back when I was on all the time. sweatdrop
So no, definately not conspiring against others. They keep each other in check alot of the time.

Regardless of what certain individuals on Gaia may or may not be 'up to,' there's no doubt in my mind that LilaMalvae is unique in her asessment. People will react to things in different ways, and hopefully the concerned individuals are aware of how they sometimes can come off.

What irritates me most, however, about the whole issue, is the prevaling attitude of "I'm right and you're wrong" or "this isn't just my opinion, it's a fact written in stone" when things are far from being that cut and dry. Boiling it down, I think both positions are by their nature correct, though I tend to support the Progressive/Dedicatory side of things because the consequences of that view are more to my prefference, not neccesarily because I believe that position is more correct. I want to see both Traditional Wicca AND Dedicatory Wicca flourish in their own ways.

Were the one-sided sentimentality to dissapear from all the "Wiccan FAQs" and such that are often around, I'd be ecstatically happy. I've always been strongly in favor of asserting and teaching the distinctions between Traditional Wicca and Dedicatory Wicca, but quite against saying "one of these is the right way and the other isn't and can in no way be called Wicca." People can understand these distinctions and it isn't neccesary to be one-sidedly polarized about it. Doing this would also eliminate much of the biting hostility, borderline prejudcie, and occasional flaming that happens whenever the other side pops in.

But then, I'm not naive enough to believe this will actually happen. stare

Perhaps you're misunderstanding what I'm saying here... though perhaps not. I am NOT saying that initiated Wiccans aren't Wiccan. To say otherwise is ludicrous. Nor am I saying that Wicca ISN'T mystery based, initatory. What I AM saying is that while this describes Wicca, there are OTHER things that can ALSO be described as Wicca. I am NOT saying that Dedicatory Wicca and Traditional Wicca should be considered the same. They AREN'T the same. Neither are any two denominations in ANY religion. Yes, it IS a fact that Wicca is "a very structured, mystery religion that is a priesthood unto itself... etc" But it is ALSO a fact that the term Wicca is used to describe things OTHER than that specific definition. See the distinction I'm making here?

Which SET of facts you choose to pay attention to is why it becomes a matter of opinion whether or not you acknowledge one, neither, or both. Does that clear things up?

Don't get me wrong, I don't happen to believe that dedicatory wicca is really wicca. And I really get irked when somebody who knows better calls me wiccan, simply because I've never made that statement about myself.
What I was trying to do was be general, people have their own beliefs, and if somebody really thinks there is a way to be wiccan and not be formally initiated, who the ******** am I to tell them they're wrong.
That's also where I get the so-called "persecution complex", I suppose. They might be right some of the time but that doesn't mean that what they're doing is right. They have harassed me several times and I'm not going to withdraw that statement, nor will I try to "learn something" just because everyone says they're right and sometimes PEOPLE JUST HAVE THE RIGHT TO BE WRONG. Who the ******** is anybody to tell me what to think?
Yes, I know Nuri has pulled them off people, but only when it's gotten ridiculously out of hand.
I don't care if they're your friends. They can treat people better.
Also, have any of you considered the possibility of a and b both being correct? It happens sometimes, you know.
And apparently I'm not unique in my theory about them since otherwise this F-ING THREAD WOULDN'T EXIST.

Sorry for being defensive but some things that you all said were things I found offensive. Did you not read the part where I said they were very intelligent? Are you people here to pick out the things you find controversial or are you actually reading for the sake of it?

If you don't want an opinion challenged, keep it to yourself. The point of expressing opinions in a public forum is to have them challenged.

*blinks* But... I was calm...

And no more offensive or insulting than she was in regards to individuals I concider my Gaian friends. I've had heated debates with Nuri, Tea and Deo... And conversed and discussed with them since I joined Gaia a long while ago.

They correct her or disagree with her opinions or theories and state why.
That is NOT victimizing.

I contested her statement and (by the way lila) did NOT call out my friends to pick up where I left off. Nor do I ever, I'm more than capable to layout my points alone.

As to tearing apart posts. They arent doing it to be condescending.
When a post is long or has many points the respondee needs to address, its much clearer if the individual dissects the post into quotes and addresses each point in turn so that there is no confusion as to what specifically is being referred to at any given time. Its something you pick up in debate forums that is also very useful outside of debate forums.

As to their posting times. So what? They're friends and frequent the same discussion areas as well as are online usually about the same times. Your point? Do they have to wait a certain amount of time before posting in the same thread?

Or treating people like adults could mean the person should be mature enough to have their opinions contested, accept corrections, listen to contestation or opinions regarding personal theories or handle the simple manner of debate... All without getting irate.

And as Eric said. If you dont want anyone questioning or contesting your opinions, dont post them in a Public forum.

Your also the only one thinking of this as a fight. Every time I question you, you claim its fighting. Seriously, your going to have to get used to it.
Questioning and disagreements are a common part of human interaction. Especially in forums.

You slandered / insulted Deo, Tea and Nuri's character... Regardless of your assumptions and accusations against them, thats shoddy character on *your* part. Especially concidering they themselves arent hear to speak for themselves.

By all means, keep your opinion. Just dont get all hackled when its questioned or contested.


(Nihlist: Civil enough? I seriously to not let the blunt come across as offensive. If it did, at least I gave it a shot.)