Advise Me, Friends

[Requiem ex Inferni]

ArmasTermin

Two more points.

I don't actually know what the slide release does on a pump shotgun. lol

I believe chokes work by forcing the shot and sabot through a smaller diameter than the bore, changing the pattern. Am I wrong?

If it's what I'm thinking it is, it's a little button that releases the slide. My friend's grandpa's shotgun is designed so that the pump won't slide unless there's something in the chamber, or if you press a button next to the trigger.  

[Man of the Demoneye]

Requiem in Mortis

ArmasTermin

Two more points.

I don't actually know what the slide release does on a pump shotgun. lol

I believe chokes work by forcing the shot and sabot through a smaller diameter than the bore, changing the pattern. Am I wrong?

If it's what I'm thinking it is, it's a little button that releases the slide. My friend's grandpa's shotgun is designed so that the pump won't slide unless there's something in the chamber, or if you press a button next to the trigger.

+1

It's pretty much always either on the front of the trigger guard or directly behind. When the action closes on a pump, it locks forward. To unlock it and open the chamber / eject a shell, the button must be depressed or the gun fired.  

[Fresnel]

ArmasTermin

Two more points.

I don't actually know what the slide release does on a pump shotgun. lol

Like they said, when the action closes, it locks. To un-lock it, either press the button or pull the trigger. Sometimes you want to eject a shell unfired, to switch your load. I can't see how it would be horribly necessary, but some people like that. The downside is that Benelli is the only brand I know of with a matching feed disconnector that makes it possible to eject an unfired shell and feed a new shell into the action directly. Everyone else requires that you put that shell into the magazine, because it'll automatically feed every time you pump the gun. And if your magazine is full, you're ******** class="quote">

Quote:

I believe chokes work by forcing the shot and sabot through a smaller diameter than the bore, changing the pattern. Am I wrong?

[ArmasTermin]

Fresnel

ArmasTermin

Two more points.

I don't actually know what the slide release does on a pump shotgun. lol

Like they said, when the action closes, it locks. To un-lock it, either press the button or pull the trigger. Sometimes you want to eject a shell unfired, to switch your load. I can't see how it would be horribly necessary, but some people like that. The downside is that Benelli is the only brand I know of with a matching feed disconnector that makes it possible to eject an unfired shell and feed a new shell into the action directly. Everyone else requires that you put that shell into the magazine, because it'll automatically feed every time you pump the gun. And if your magazine is full, you're ******** class="quote">

Quote:

I believe chokes work by forcing the shot and sabot through a smaller diameter than the bore, changing the pattern. Am I wrong?

Correct. Generally, the smaller the choke, the tighter the pattern. However, individual loads often have more effect on pattern than the choke used.

The outlier here is the rifled choke though. It doesn't constrict (or maybe it does just a bit, to grab Foster slugs), it just gives a few inches of rifling, to help spin a rifled slug, or give a saboted slug some measure of accuracy. It doesn't do as much as a rifled barrel, but it's still notably better than a smoothbore.

[Fresnel]

ArmasTermin

Fresnel

ArmasTermin

Two more points.

I don't actually know what the slide release does on a pump shotgun. lol

Like they said, when the action closes, it locks. To un-lock it, either press the button or pull the trigger. Sometimes you want to eject a shell unfired, to switch your load. I can't see how it would be horribly necessary, but some people like that. The downside is that Benelli is the only brand I know of with a matching feed disconnector that makes it possible to eject an unfired shell and feed a new shell into the action directly. Everyone else requires that you put that shell into the magazine, because it'll automatically feed every time you pump the gun. And if your magazine is full, you're ******** class="quote">

Quote:

I believe chokes work by forcing the shot and sabot through a smaller diameter than the bore, changing the pattern. Am I wrong?

Correct. Generally, the smaller the choke, the tighter the pattern. However, individual loads often have more effect on pattern than the choke used.

The outlier here is the rifled choke though. It doesn't constrict (or maybe it does just a bit, to grab Foster slugs), it just gives a few inches of rifling, to help spin a rifled slug, or give a saboted slug some measure of accuracy. It doesn't do as much as a rifled barrel, but it's still notably better than a smoothbore.

So you can't repeatedly cycle the action to eject all shells in the magazine?

On chokes, I thought that was how they worked, but it always seemed dangerous and ineffective.

[owenmarco]

Any studies to correlate the increased performance? Everyone else says they're gimmicks and worthless.

For Fosters, you have a soft lead slug moving at speed, that SLAMS into the rifling. it's going to slide across them and impart no spin, but it will tighten that choke until it won't come back out, and it will lead the ******** out of it. It's not long enough to put any appreciable spin on a soft plastic sabot, either, and that's IF the polymer molds to the rifling before it exits.
They're for people who are too cheap to buy a rifled barrel, and too gullible so they fall for the marketing hype instead of learning the best slug/choke combination for THEIR gun, or to do a bit of research and find out that Brennekke slugs are inherently more accurate because of a tighter fit with the bore.  

[owenmarco]

Fresnel

ArmasTermin

Mossberg has a bayonet lug, which I can see myself screwing around with. And that would be fun.

This will be among the last things that I add to my 870.

And where does the ring on the bayonet go?

Lug isn't the only thing you need. You also need a compatible point for the over-barrel portion of the bayonet. the 590 has a similar lug, but it actually has a point on the end of the magazine cap for the ring to fit.  

[owenmarco]

Hans Reiker

Fresnel

ArmasTermin

Mossberg has a bayonet lug, which I can see myself screwing around with. And that would be fun.

This will be among the last things that I add to my 870.

So more than likely, I will have the money for anything like up to 700 bucks. I am now debating between a Mossberg 590A1 and the Remington 870 Police Magnum, I don't know what I want!

If you know where to find good deals, you could possibly get a Mossberg 930 SPX for that. It's about damn certain if you go used.


I think it's unsafe, but apparently there is a following for this kind of thing. You can load the 8-round model to 9 rounds by putting one on the elevator, it's called "ghost loading". Personally, as stated, I think it's unsafe, but apparently it still works and it doesn't mess with feeding somehow.  

[Requiem ex Inferni]

I always wondered about whether loading a round into the chamber and then loading the magazine would damage the weapon. Shotgun's the only thing I'd be willing to try it on, though.  

[owenmarco]

Requiem in Mortis

I always wondered about whether loading a round into the chamber and then loading the magazine would damage the weapon. Shotgun's the only thing I'd be willing to try it on, though.

It shouldn't. There's a reason a lot of places, businesses, and people use "+1". It means a round in the chamber. On guns with an extractor design like the 1911's, you'll want to load that round in the chamber FROM a magazine and then loading another round in the magazine, because slamming it closed on a round can damage the extractor. It slides in from under it when the round is loaded from a magazine.  

[ArmasTermin]

I saw a six-shot Mossberg 500 Persuader at my local Academy for $350. All the Remington combat shotguns they had were the older Express models with the foregrip that covers the shell elevator when the slide is back.

I don't want to "settle" for anything, even if the Persuader is a fine gun. I'll have to find another local gun shop or wait for the upcoming gun show.

EDIT: Oh yeah, and that Avatar movie was really good.

EDIT Again: I got to handle that Persuader, and another Mossberg I didn't look at the name for. I guess I always overestimate the weight of shotguns. It was extraordinarily handy, though the rubber butt plate was a bit grabby with my jacket.  

[owenmarco]

ArmasTermin

I saw a six-shot Mossberg 500 Persuader at my local Academy for $350. All the Remington combat shotguns they had were the older Express models with the foregrip that covers the shell elevator when the slide is back.

I don't want to "settle" for anything, even if the Persuader is a fine gun. I'll have to find another local gun shop or wait for the upcoming gun show.

EDIT: Oh yeah, and that Avatar movie was really good.

EDIT Again: I got to handle that Persuader, and another Mossberg I didn't look at the name for. I guess I always overestimate the weight of shotguns. It was extraordinarily handy, though the rubber butt plate was a bit grabby with my jacket.

Academy is a rip. Academy has it for $315, WITH the PGO kit (PGO is shitty and useless for anyone but breacher teams, but it's still an additional feature).
I managed to get my 8-shot model for $300 out-the-door with constructive bartering and being a common customer of the shop.
How the ******** are you settling for anything? If anything, you're SETTLING with the remington, because it's not an actual combat shotgun. It's a modified bird gun, and it shows with many of their key features. Mossberg created their 500 and 590 series shotguns specifically for combat and security.

The remington also has design flaws they had to remedy with several different modifications. The flexi-tab, for one, is a small u-shaped cutout that allows the bolt to jump over rounds, when they have ejected from the magazine on top of the elevator, such as a mis-fed round or out-of-spec walmart specials. Non-flexi-tab guns are locked solid because the bolt can't get over the rim.
Before the Flexi-tab, there were select models released with a cut in the elevator for a knife blade to push the round back in the magazine.


Grabby is good. It means it's slightly softer (USUALLY), meaning slightly better recoil absorption. Also means a good seat in the shoulder with minimal movement. Mine is a bit stiff, but I'll probably switch it with a Limbsaver that's a bit thinner anyway. I need a 12.5" LOP, and it's 13" right now.  

[Fresnel]

owenmarco

Any studies to correlate the increased performance? Everyone else says they're gimmicks and worthless.

For Fosters, you have a soft lead slug moving at speed, that SLAMS into the rifling. it's going to slide across them and impart no spin, but it will tighten that choke until it won't come back out, and it will lead the ******** out of it. It's not long enough to put any appreciable spin on a soft plastic sabot, either, and that's IF the polymer molds to the rifling before it exits.
They're for people who are too cheap to buy a rifled barrel, and too gullible so they fall for the marketing hype instead of learning the best slug/choke combination for THEIR gun, or to do a bit of research and find out that Brennekke slugs are inherently more accurate because of a tighter fit with the bore.

I cannot find ******** ANYBODY who has done any real tests on it, except one guy who did tests with saboted rounds and found a saboted round through a rifled choke is roughly as accurate as a rifled slug and an open choke, but it's FIRABLE. I'm sure you remember Box 'o Truth's tests of saboted slugs in a cylinder bore?  

[Fresnel]

owenmarco

Fresnel

ArmasTermin

Mossberg has a bayonet lug, which I can see myself screwing around with. And that would be fun.

This will be among the last things that I add to my 870.

And where does the ring on the bayonet go?

Lug isn't the only thing you need. You also need a compatible point for the over-barrel portion of the bayonet. the 590 has a similar lug, but it actually has a point on the end of the magazine cap for the ring to fit.

Remington extensions have a neck-down step at the end that I assume is the right size.

 

[Fresnel]

Requiem in Mortis

I always wondered about whether loading a round into the chamber and then loading the magazine would damage the weapon. Shotgun's the only thing I'd be willing to try it on, though.

That's standard USN loading procedure. Slam one in the chamber, THEN load the mag. That way if someone sneaks up on you while you're loading, your gun is live.