Holy grail of AK,SKS,MOSIN accessories/ russian BDUs

[Recon_Ninja_985]

Fresnel

Recon_Ninja_985

Fresnel

Recon_Ninja_985

SpeedmanRC

@Ninja, yeah I only load a box in the mag by hand. doing it with a clip only works for like 5-8 out of the ten and it's just bogs up.

well I don't know what gut I want with some of my tax money this year... It's going to be a Saiga but...I rather save a bit and get one in 223 so I can convert it, get a few extra mags, ammo, scope and stuff. I would like a 12 too but I don't have much use for a shotgun at this time.

word of advice.

check out the saiga 5.45
much cheaper to shoot, as well as easier to convert to ak platform than the other saiga calibers


it can already take ak74 mags without conversion work to the magwell area and has other new goodies that weren't included on previous saiga rifles that also make the conversion process much easier

5.45 ammo is cheap and in bulk and performs similarly to 223, take advantage of it ninja

You know what kills me about the Saiga? I dunno if the rifles do this, but the -12 does. The action doesn't lock open on empty. I think it's just an AK, but it bugs the s**t out of me. Factory-new Saigas tend to jam a lot for the first couple hundred rounds, and jams (or at least the stovepipe I got) are ******** tough to clear when the bolt can't lock open. Maybe rimmed shotgun ammo makes that worse, but I could NOT clear that jam. Had to give it back to the owner, who'd been dealing with stovepipes all day.

I think your'e just worried about the saiga 12.

Saiga 7.62x39 and 5.45x39 are essentially the only legal russian made AK types that can be imported, so if you were to convert one you would pretty much have yourself a russian made AK.

theres little difference between an AK 100 series and a converted saiga.

saiga shotguns are kind of a thing that izmash is pioneering, THOSE have a break in period because of what it is.

The break-in period is another issue entirely, I'm just talking about the lack of a bolt hold-open. When it jams, because every gun jams eventually, it's too damn hard to clear.

same goes for all AK variants..no bolt hold open. they dont need one, no rifle needs one.

but heres the thing,their magazines pretty much always feed flawlessly, and its made with looser tolerances in the chamber. thats about 90% of the big problems eliminated.

should anything happen even after that, the AK series is extremely easy to clear.

I have no idea what a bolt hold open has to do with clearing a weapon, it doesnt make sense. IMHO that just takes longer to fool with.

for both AK and AR I find it MUCH faster to simply remove the magazine, pull the charging handle and maybe shake if necessary

so simple that I thought everyone did this...  

[Fresnel]

Recon_Ninja_985

Fresnel

Recon_Ninja_985

Fresnel

Recon_Ninja_985

SpeedmanRC

@Ninja, yeah I only load a box in the mag by hand. doing it with a clip only works for like 5-8 out of the ten and it's just bogs up.

well I don't know what gut I want with some of my tax money this year... It's going to be a Saiga but...I rather save a bit and get one in 223 so I can convert it, get a few extra mags, ammo, scope and stuff. I would like a 12 too but I don't have much use for a shotgun at this time.

word of advice.

check out the saiga 5.45
much cheaper to shoot, as well as easier to convert to ak platform than the other saiga calibers


it can already take ak74 mags without conversion work to the magwell area and has other new goodies that weren't included on previous saiga rifles that also make the conversion process much easier

5.45 ammo is cheap and in bulk and performs similarly to 223, take advantage of it ninja

You know what kills me about the Saiga? I dunno if the rifles do this, but the -12 does. The action doesn't lock open on empty. I think it's just an AK, but it bugs the s**t out of me. Factory-new Saigas tend to jam a lot for the first couple hundred rounds, and jams (or at least the stovepipe I got) are ******** tough to clear when the bolt can't lock open. Maybe rimmed shotgun ammo makes that worse, but I could NOT clear that jam. Had to give it back to the owner, who'd been dealing with stovepipes all day.

I think your'e just worried about the saiga 12.

Saiga 7.62x39 and 5.45x39 are essentially the only legal russian made AK types that can be imported, so if you were to convert one you would pretty much have yourself a russian made AK.

theres little difference between an AK 100 series and a converted saiga.

saiga shotguns are kind of a thing that izmash is pioneering, THOSE have a break in period because of what it is.

The break-in period is another issue entirely, I'm just talking about the lack of a bolt hold-open. When it jams, because every gun jams eventually, it's too damn hard to clear.

same goes for all AK variants..no bolt hold open. they dont need one, no rifle needs one.

but heres the thing,their magazines pretty much always feed flawlessly, and its made with looser tolerances in the chamber. thats about 90% of the big problems eliminated.

should anything happen even after that, the AK series is extremely easy to clear.

I have no idea what a bolt hold open has to do with clearing a weapon, it doesnt make sense. IMHO that just takes longer to fool with.

for both AK and AR I find it MUCH faster to simply remove the magazine, pull the charging handle and maybe shake if necessary

so simple that I thought everyone did this...

When you're extracting a rimmed round stovepipe, it becomes a three-handed job. The shell would NOT come out, because the rim kept catching on the edge of the ejection port. I had my right hand supporting the shotgun's weight, and my left hand had to both manually extract the hull AND hold the bolt open. On an AR, I could have locked the bolt back and had it cleared in under ten seconds, but I fought with the Saiga for a good twenty seconds before the owner took it back and shook it savagely until the hull fell out on its own.  

[Recon_Ninja_985]

Fresnel

Recon_Ninja_985

Fresnel

Recon_Ninja_985

Fresnel

You know what kills me about the Saiga? I dunno if the rifles do this, but the -12 does. The action doesn't lock open on empty. I think it's just an AK, but it bugs the s**t out of me. Factory-new Saigas tend to jam a lot for the first couple hundred rounds, and jams (or at least the stovepipe I got) are ******** tough to clear when the bolt can't lock open. Maybe rimmed shotgun ammo makes that worse, but I could NOT clear that jam. Had to give it back to the owner, who'd been dealing with stovepipes all day.

I think your'e just worried about the saiga 12.

Saiga 7.62x39 and 5.45x39 are essentially the only legal russian made AK types that can be imported, so if you were to convert one you would pretty much have yourself a russian made AK.

theres little difference between an AK 100 series and a converted saiga.

saiga shotguns are kind of a thing that izmash is pioneering, THOSE have a break in period because of what it is.

The break-in period is another issue entirely, I'm just talking about the lack of a bolt hold-open. When it jams, because every gun jams eventually, it's too damn hard to clear.

same goes for all AK variants..no bolt hold open. they dont need one, no rifle needs one.

but heres the thing,their magazines pretty much always feed flawlessly, and its made with looser tolerances in the chamber. thats about 90% of the big problems eliminated.

should anything happen even after that, the AK series is extremely easy to clear.

I have no idea what a bolt hold open has to do with clearing a weapon, it doesnt make sense. IMHO that just takes longer to fool with.

for both AK and AR I find it MUCH faster to simply remove the magazine, pull the charging handle and maybe shake if necessary

so simple that I thought everyone did this...

When you're extracting a rimmed round stovepipe, it becomes a three-handed job. The shell would NOT come out, because the rim kept catching on the edge of the ejection port. I had my right hand supporting the shotgun's weight, and my left hand had to both manually extract the hull AND hold the bolt open. On an AR, I could have locked the bolt back and had it cleared in under ten seconds, but I fought with the Saiga for a good twenty seconds before the owner took it back and shook it savagely until the hull fell out on its own.

gahh yer doin et wrong gonk

turn sideways, pull back charging handle all the way, shake . did you remove the mag first? sometimes with an S12 or AK you can hold it upright and rack the handle multiple times til it falls out the magwell while shaking

maybe the S12 isnt your thing, but any other saiga or AK is totally different as they arent shotguns....

I think all of your frustration is all centered around a single bad event and not much experience in dealing with the AK platform.

if you arent used to the system and it gives you trouble of course it's going to be awkward to deal with  

[Fresnel]

Recon_Ninja_985

Fresnel

Recon_Ninja_985

Fresnel

Recon_Ninja_985

Fresnel

You know what kills me about the Saiga? I dunno if the rifles do this, but the -12 does. The action doesn't lock open on empty. I think it's just an AK, but it bugs the s**t out of me. Factory-new Saigas tend to jam a lot for the first couple hundred rounds, and jams (or at least the stovepipe I got) are ******** tough to clear when the bolt can't lock open. Maybe rimmed shotgun ammo makes that worse, but I could NOT clear that jam. Had to give it back to the owner, who'd been dealing with stovepipes all day.

I think your'e just worried about the saiga 12.

Saiga 7.62x39 and 5.45x39 are essentially the only legal russian made AK types that can be imported, so if you were to convert one you would pretty much have yourself a russian made AK.

theres little difference between an AK 100 series and a converted saiga.

saiga shotguns are kind of a thing that izmash is pioneering, THOSE have a break in period because of what it is.

The break-in period is another issue entirely, I'm just talking about the lack of a bolt hold-open. When it jams, because every gun jams eventually, it's too damn hard to clear.

same goes for all AK variants..no bolt hold open. they dont need one, no rifle needs one.

but heres the thing,their magazines pretty much always feed flawlessly, and its made with looser tolerances in the chamber. thats about 90% of the big problems eliminated.

should anything happen even after that, the AK series is extremely easy to clear.

I have no idea what a bolt hold open has to do with clearing a weapon, it doesnt make sense. IMHO that just takes longer to fool with.

for both AK and AR I find it MUCH faster to simply remove the magazine, pull the charging handle and maybe shake if necessary

so simple that I thought everyone did this...

When you're extracting a rimmed round stovepipe, it becomes a three-handed job. The shell would NOT come out, because the rim kept catching on the edge of the ejection port. I had my right hand supporting the shotgun's weight, and my left hand had to both manually extract the hull AND hold the bolt open. On an AR, I could have locked the bolt back and had it cleared in under ten seconds, but I fought with the Saiga for a good twenty seconds before the owner took it back and shook it savagely until the hull fell out on its own.

gahh yer doin et wrong gonk

turn sideways, pull back charging handle all the way, shake . did you remove the mag first? sometimes with an S12 or AK you can hold it upright and rack the handle multiple times til it falls out the magwell while shaking

maybe the S12 isnt your thing, but any other saiga or AK is totally different as they arent shotguns....

I think all of your frustration is all centered around a single bad event and not much experience in dealing with the AK platform.

if you arent used to the system and it gives you trouble of course it's going to be awkward to deal with

That's exactly what I did, and the rim kept snagging on something inside and the hull wouldn't fall out, that's why the owner had to shake the ******** out of it like a screaming baby, and it finally dropped out. I watched him do this three or four other times before I got the gun, and thought I could do it better. Apparently, I couldn't. I didn't remove the mag, because I didn't think that should ever be necessary.

I'm not saying it's a bad gun, really, I'm just saying that it really should have a bolt hold-open.  

[Recon_Ninja_985]

Fresnel

Recon_Ninja_985

Fresnel

Recon_Ninja_985

Fresnel

The break-in period is another issue entirely, I'm just talking about the lack of a bolt hold-open. When it jams, because every gun jams eventually, it's too damn hard to clear.

same goes for all AK variants..no bolt hold open. they dont need one, no rifle needs one.

but heres the thing,their magazines pretty much always feed flawlessly, and its made with looser tolerances in the chamber. thats about 90% of the big problems eliminated.

should anything happen even after that, the AK series is extremely easy to clear.

I have no idea what a bolt hold open has to do with clearing a weapon, it doesnt make sense. IMHO that just takes longer to fool with.

for both AK and AR I find it MUCH faster to simply remove the magazine, pull the charging handle and maybe shake if necessary

so simple that I thought everyone did this...

When you're extracting a rimmed round stovepipe, it becomes a three-handed job. The shell would NOT come out, because the rim kept catching on the edge of the ejection port. I had my right hand supporting the shotgun's weight, and my left hand had to both manually extract the hull AND hold the bolt open. On an AR, I could have locked the bolt back and had it cleared in under ten seconds, but I fought with the Saiga for a good twenty seconds before the owner took it back and shook it savagely until the hull fell out on its own.

gahh yer doin et wrong gonk

turn sideways, pull back charging handle all the way, shake . did you remove the mag first? sometimes with an S12 or AK you can hold it upright and rack the handle multiple times til it falls out the magwell while shaking

maybe the S12 isnt your thing, but any other saiga or AK is totally different as they arent shotguns....

I think all of your frustration is all centered around a single bad event and not much experience in dealing with the AK platform.

if you arent used to the system and it gives you trouble of course it's going to be awkward to deal with

That's exactly what I did, and the rim kept snagging on something inside and the hull wouldn't fall out, that's why the owner had to shake the ******** out of it like a screaming baby, and it finally dropped out. I watched him do this three or four other times before I got the gun, and thought I could do it better. Apparently, I couldn't. I didn't remove the mag, because I didn't think that should ever be necessary.

I'm not saying it's a bad gun, really, I'm just saying that it really should have a bolt hold-open.

thats actually something pretty popular with S12 owners.

theres an aftermarket bolt release you can buy.

looks good to me
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5LwV0OS3m0&feature=related  

[Fresnel]

Recon_Ninja_985

Fresnel

Recon_Ninja_985

Fresnel

Recon_Ninja_985

Fresnel

The break-in period is another issue entirely, I'm just talking about the lack of a bolt hold-open. When it jams, because every gun jams eventually, it's too damn hard to clear.

same goes for all AK variants..no bolt hold open. they dont need one, no rifle needs one.

but heres the thing,their magazines pretty much always feed flawlessly, and its made with looser tolerances in the chamber. thats about 90% of the big problems eliminated.

should anything happen even after that, the AK series is extremely easy to clear.

I have no idea what a bolt hold open has to do with clearing a weapon, it doesnt make sense. IMHO that just takes longer to fool with.

for both AK and AR I find it MUCH faster to simply remove the magazine, pull the charging handle and maybe shake if necessary

so simple that I thought everyone did this...

When you're extracting a rimmed round stovepipe, it becomes a three-handed job. The shell would NOT come out, because the rim kept catching on the edge of the ejection port. I had my right hand supporting the shotgun's weight, and my left hand had to both manually extract the hull AND hold the bolt open. On an AR, I could have locked the bolt back and had it cleared in under ten seconds, but I fought with the Saiga for a good twenty seconds before the owner took it back and shook it savagely until the hull fell out on its own.

gahh yer doin et wrong gonk

turn sideways, pull back charging handle all the way, shake . did you remove the mag first? sometimes with an S12 or AK you can hold it upright and rack the handle multiple times til it falls out the magwell while shaking

maybe the S12 isnt your thing, but any other saiga or AK is totally different as they arent shotguns....

I think all of your frustration is all centered around a single bad event and not much experience in dealing with the AK platform.

if you arent used to the system and it gives you trouble of course it's going to be awkward to deal with

That's exactly what I did, and the rim kept snagging on something inside and the hull wouldn't fall out, that's why the owner had to shake the ******** out of it like a screaming baby, and it finally dropped out. I watched him do this three or four other times before I got the gun, and thought I could do it better. Apparently, I couldn't. I didn't remove the mag, because I didn't think that should ever be necessary.

I'm not saying it's a bad gun, really, I'm just saying that it really should have a bolt hold-open.

thats actually something pretty popular with S12 owners.

theres an aftermarket bolt release you can buy.

looks good to me
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5LwV0OS3m0&feature=related

Dude looks like whatsisface from 90210. xd