Atheism vs Christianity

[KangheadSaysHi]

just remember.
Budda isn't a god.
He's just another being like us who tried to guide people through a perfect life.

So it's impossible to really "not belive" in budda  

[TenSin]

LimeyFish8

Angel of Music

Taka Seiyaryu

Angel of Music

Taka Seiyaryu

Used_Bookstore

Just for the record Jesus was real and did walk on this earth. Whether you believe He was a prophet or was the son of God is up to you but there are countless number of records outside of the Bible that say He was real. And just out of curiosity how are you sure there is no God. What kind of proof are you looking for? I'm asking in all seriousness. I'm not asking to get a rile out of you or start an argument; I genially want to know why. And it sounds like to me that you are basing Christianity off of church and church functions. And if you are going to look at the Christian faith don't base it off of church. Base it off of God's word and from your experience with God. There are a lot of hypocrites in the church, and when I say church I mean the entire Christian church not just the Catholic church. sweatdrop I believe personally it's one of the worst things about being a Christian. While I believe church is important to the Christian walk, since it gives you a place to gather information and support from other Christians there is a lot of hypocrisy and it's one of the biggest reasons why most unbelievers don't become a Christian. I hope you are not basing your view of Christianity just because of that. Also it seems that you have dealt with people who were pushy or arrogant as you said. I'm sorry you were treated this way and I personally don't fell its right to push your religion on to someone else. Talking about it is fine but pushing it on to someone is not the right way to go about it. But honestly from what I've gathered from your post; granted I might be wrong since I don't know you, but it sounds like you are the arrogant one. You say there is no God yet you offered no proof to say He isn't real and you seemed to have based your views of Christianity off of a select group of people. Like I said before I'm not saying this to stir up trouble but I'm just expressing my opinion and this is just my response to Taka's post ^_^

I say there is no God because there has been no proof of such a being shown to me. When I was little I too used to pray to this possibly-nonexistant being. Ever since I even started bad things kept happening to me. My mother would abuse me, my grades would suck, and it seemed like no matter what I did I always got yelled at. Even when I stopped praying, the abuse would continue and more abuse was added to it. I almost lost my best friend because of my mother's abuse. I had to take matters into my own hands because this so-called "God" apparently didn't want anything to do with me. burning_eyes And since I declared myself an Atheist, all of these things have stopped. Since then I have been leading a good life with my father. I'm in love with a guy I can trust, and Mother has basically dropped right out of the picture.

Now, whether this proves the existance of God or proves the NON-existance of God, I have yet to decide for myself. In answer to your question "What sort of proof are you looking for", I search for physical evidence, if possible. If this "God" thing is real, he should be able to come before me face-to-face and prove his existance to me. If he can't or won't, then I have every right to believe that he does not exist.

Okay first of all God is a spirt now and he won't be back until the end of the world but he is here now for he is all around us.

I'm really sorry for what happened to you. Thats awful. But you can't blame God. God wasen't the one who abused you. Sometimes when you pray for something the answer doesn't come right away but if you keep having faith God will answer your prayers. Hes answered a lot of mine. I lost a best friend because I was to "good" for her taste. Guess what happened to her? She steals now and shes into some bad stuff.

All I can say is God died for you. There is the bible to prove it. And if your not greatful for that than thats to bad. If your gonna hold a grudge on God for something bad that happened in the past that wasen't even God's fault than thats to bad. I understand it must be harder for you to believe now but talk to your Christian friends, listen to them, open your mind. I'm not gonna try to force my opinion on you but I just feel it's to bad that after what happened to you, you can't be greatful that eventually you did get through it and have been blessed with a lot.

Oh, how convenient. Spirit, eh? Well then the least he could do is show his face to me in a dream or something. If he wants me to believe in him so bad he's got to prove he exists first. The Bible does nothing for him. In my eyes, it's just another work of fiction written ages ago. And, grateful for what? He didn't die. Jesus did, and he was nothing more than a prophet. I do not blame God for what happened to me. All I'm saying is praying to him does nothing for me. He doesn't want anything to do with me, apparently, so he has made no attempt to answer my prayers in any form or way.

Since he was nice enough to answer your prayers: good for you. He likes you. You can go hang out in Heaven and I'll go hang out in Hell and try to become a general like Azazel. 3nodding

Jesus was the son of God. God gave up his son. Which is hard. Sometimes answering prayers just takes time. But look at what you have now? Don't you think things have turned up. I can't make you believe or anything but there are answers to your questions and sometimes we just don't know and its a mystery as to why God doesn't always answer our prayers right away. I do know that he loves all of us equally. Including you.

Would a loving and caring, omnipotent diety allow half of the world to starve? Would it allow famine, pestilence, and war to tear countries and people apart? You say that it answers a lot of questions, that is what religion is for. Suspend, for a moment, your acceptance that there is a god and think about why religon would be invented with out one. Just think about that. This issue is so difficult to debate because neither side is willing to consider the possibility that the other might be right. I have spent a lot of time thinking about it and while saying that there is a god answers many many questions, but for me it doesn't answer them satisfactorily. Its a personal issue and in debate the impass that is most commonly reached is wether or not there is proof for either answer.

Usually it isn't God that allows people to starve, usually it's a human's own fault that he is starving or dying. God gave us free will. Humans abuse this and don't follow God's will. That is why there is war, and famine and disease. It's our own fault. In the Bible, things like that entered the world because of sin. So it's not God who is letting things like this happen, it is us who stubbornly refuse to let God guide them. It is a a difficult debate thought, you are right. But like I said people are stubborn and prideful. People don't want to admit they are wrong. And I don't mean to offend you but thinking that truth is a personal matter is very prideful indeed. I don't claim to know everyting, but I do know a very important singular truth that you probably know but don't accept. God says in the Bible that He created us with a knowledge of Him. So it annoys me when people say there is no God. It's because I know that God exists and He works in His ways, but people who don't know how to look for Him or haven't been shown how to see His work are the people who don't think He exists. If you read the Bible, and take time to understand it then you start to see how God takes care of us if we saty in His will. God takes care of me, I know that for sure. And I bet He takes care of you too, and everyone else.
Wow, that turned out pretty long but I think I needed to say it.  

[TenSin]

Taka Seiyaryu

Angel of Music

Taka Seiyaryu

Used_Bookstore

Just for the record Jesus was real and did walk on this earth. Whether you believe He was a prophet or was the son of God is up to you but there are countless number of records outside of the Bible that say He was real. And just out of curiosity how are you sure there is no God. What kind of proof are you looking for? I'm asking in all seriousness. I'm not asking to get a rile out of you or start an argument; I genially want to know why. And it sounds like to me that you are basing Christianity off of church and church functions. And if you are going to look at the Christian faith don't base it off of church. Base it off of God's word and from your experience with God. There are a lot of hypocrites in the church, and when I say church I mean the entire Christian church not just the Catholic church. sweatdrop I believe personally it's one of the worst things about being a Christian. While I believe church is important to the Christian walk, since it gives you a place to gather information and support from other Christians there is a lot of hypocrisy and it's one of the biggest reasons why most unbelievers don't become a Christian. I hope you are not basing your view of Christianity just because of that. Also it seems that you have dealt with people who were pushy or arrogant as you said. I'm sorry you were treated this way and I personally don't fell its right to push your religion on to someone else. Talking about it is fine but pushing it on to someone is not the right way to go about it. But honestly from what I've gathered from your post; granted I might be wrong since I don't know you, but it sounds like you are the arrogant one. You say there is no God yet you offered no proof to say He isn't real and you seemed to have based your views of Christianity off of a select group of people. Like I said before I'm not saying this to stir up trouble but I'm just expressing my opinion and this is just my response to Taka's post ^_^

I say there is no God because there has been no proof of such a being shown to me. When I was little I too used to pray to this possibly-nonexistant being. Ever since I even started bad things kept happening to me. My mother would abuse me, my grades would suck, and it seemed like no matter what I did I always got yelled at. Even when I stopped praying, the abuse would continue and more abuse was added to it. I almost lost my best friend because of my mother's abuse. I had to take matters into my own hands because this so-called "God" apparently didn't want anything to do with me. burning_eyes And since I declared myself an Atheist, all of these things have stopped. Since then I have been leading a good life with my father. I'm in love with a guy I can trust, and Mother has basically dropped right out of the picture.

Now, whether this proves the existance of God or proves the NON-existance of God, I have yet to decide for myself. In answer to your question "What sort of proof are you looking for", I search for physical evidence, if possible. If this "God" thing is real, he should be able to come before me face-to-face and prove his existance to me. If he can't or won't, then I have every right to believe that he does not exist.

Okay first of all God is a spirt now and he won't be back until the end of the world but he is here now for he is all around us.

I'm really sorry for what happened to you. Thats awful. But you can't blame God. God wasen't the one who abused you. Sometimes when you pray for something the answer doesn't come right away but if you keep having faith God will answer your prayers. Hes answered a lot of mine. I lost a best friend because I was to "good" for her taste. Guess what happened to her? She steals now and shes into some bad stuff.

All I can say is God died for you. There is the bible to prove it. And if your not greatful for that than thats to bad. If your gonna hold a grudge on God for something bad that happened in the past that wasen't even God's fault than thats to bad. I understand it must be harder for you to believe now but talk to your Christian friends, listen to them, open your mind. I'm not gonna try to force my opinion on you but I just feel it's to bad that after what happened to you, you can't be greatful that eventually you did get through it and have been blessed with a lot.

Oh, how convenient. Spirit, eh? Well then the least he could do is show his face to me in a dream or something. If he wants me to believe in him so bad he's got to prove he exists first. The Bible does nothing for him. In my eyes, it's just another work of fiction written ages ago. And, grateful for what? He didn't die. Jesus did, and he was nothing more than a prophet. I do not blame God for what happened to me. All I'm saying is praying to him does nothing for me. He doesn't want anything to do with me, apparently, so he has made no attempt to answer my prayers in any form or way.

Since he was nice enough to answer your prayers: good for you. He likes you. You can go hang out in Heaven and I'll go hang out in Hell and try to become a general like Azazel. 3nodding

How prideful! God shows Himself to you everyday! You just don't know it because you're too busy thinking about what is good for YOU and how YOUR so great that God should have to show himself to you! The Bible is the oldest book of "fiction" that I know that has been read and believed over all this time. Why would something so false and impossible still be around? WAIT A MINUTE? COULD IT BE TRUE? I think it is at least. If you understood the trinity then you would know that Jesus and God are one. Meaning that He died on the cross. So don't claim to know what you talk about when you say that (and don't tell me that I don't know what I'm talking about because I do). God madly wants you to love Him. And you say He doesn't answer your prayers? Well let me ask you then, what have you been praying for? "You ask and do not recieve because you ask amiss." That's straight from the Bible.  

[TenSin]

Sorry I kinda couldn't help myself there. Double posting long posts that no one will probably read anyway.  

[TenSin]

Kyomii Kitsune

Angel of Music

Okay first of all not all of us hand out pamplets, and assault others who are against our beliefs.

Second of all, you are very confused and it's ovious. The bible isn't just a book. It's a historical document. If anything is true the bible is.

Oh boy here we go...

I hate to double post, and hopefully someone will post something by the time I post this, but I couldn't NOT reply to this. I'm sorry but I can't disagree with you more. There is no proof that the Bible actually IS a historical document. There just isn't. And to be honest I don't think there will ever be a way to prove it. But, that also mean's it can't be concretely disproven. But still, it is not a historical document. It's a book of faith, a chronicle of stories that may or may not be, to any given degree, true. There is no sure way to prove them right or wrong.

Angel of Music

Also if you do your research you'll find that while the bible is hard to believe it's the most believable explanation for the earth. Do you seriously believe the big bang therory? Have you watched the movie? A star exploded and now there are stars and water and people. Right. rolleyes

One thing you should note is that "research" and "beliefs" don't usually cooperate well in an argument. Research is based on observed truths, and beliefs are based on human intuition, which cannot be scientifically proven to be true. I find it easier to believe that tangible pieces of matter came together by scientifically proven means such as gravity to form the earth, and that evolvution (which has also been scientifically proven to exist) took over and life evolved from basic forms over billions of years than it is to believe that some omniscient, intangible, invisible, all powerful "God" decided that there would be light and animals and water etc. out of nothing. Did you know its also a proven fact that matter can not be created or destroyed, merely manipulated? So that seems to throw the whole creation out of nothing theory out the window.

The way you worded everything you said just feels like your are forcing it down peoples throats, which isn't exactly "handing out pamphlets," but it's pretty darn close. And to be honest it really sounds like an assault on them, even though you claim that you don't "assault others who are against our beliefs." You spoke with such disregard for their views, and such possessive and rude dialogue that it just makes you look exactly like the kind of person you said you are not.

EXCELLENT! While on the subject of gravity (something you cannot SEE but can FEEL) why don't we bring this to the subject of God. You can't SEE God but (at least I and many other Christians) can FEEL Him. So you say there is scientific proof of gravity? What is gravity? Is it really a tangible peice of matter like you say it is? You don't know for sure do you? But you know it exists because things fall to the ground. This is the same thing as when someone asks a believer about God. The same questions can be asked about God, but what people don't know is that God is outside time and space. That is how He could create everything, because He doesn't have the limits that we do in this world. We "shove it down your throat" because we are humans too, and feel like we need to do too much, but God's plan is perfect and even if we, who try so desperately to save you, are rejected then later God can use what we say to remind you and somehow bring you back to Him. It's something some believers call "planting the seed" that God waters and eventually sprouts hopefully. Some people just try to plant it too hard. That's all. And on that note, I'll shut up.  

[Phaeton]

TenSin

EXCELLENT! While on the subject of gravity (something you cannot SEE but can FEEL) why don't we bring this to the subject of God. You can't SEE God but (at least I and many other Christians) can FEEL Him. So you say there is scientific proof of gravity? What is gravity? Is it really a tangible peice of matter like you say it is? You don't know for sure do you? But you know it exists because things fall to the ground. This is the same thing as when someone asks a believer about God. The same questions can be asked about God, but what people don't know is that God is outside time and space. That is how He could create everything, because He doesn't have the limits that we do in this world. We "shove it down your throat" because we are humans too, and feel like we need to do too much, but God's plan is perfect and even if we, who try so desperately to save you, are rejected then later God can use what we say to remind you and somehow bring you back to Him. It's something some believers call "planting the seed" that God waters and eventually sprouts hopefully. Some people just try to plant it too hard. That's all. And on that note, I'll shut up.

The problem with that is Gravity actually has been proven. Hold up something and let it go. No matter how many times you hold up and let something go it's going to fall to the ground. Gravity is not a tangible piece of matter it is the principle that larger masses tend to attract smaller masses. It's unbelievably simple, and it's heavily supported with plenty of scientific evidence. It's a key in understanding how the planets and the sun formed as well.

Yahweh is not a principle, you can't actually prove Yahweh/Allah/Whoever the hell else you refer to as "God" exists. You can't prove that this deity exists outside of time and space, you can't even prove there is an "outside " of time and space.

Now pamplets and evangelists are irritating but at least those who follow can easily say no, but you have to admit events like the Spanish Inquisition and the Salem Witch Hunts crossed a line.

And for a historical document it's sort of odd that the Bible was written LONG after the death of christ, takes bits and pieces from multiple other pagan religions, was manipulated in order to keep American slaves in line, and even around 600 articles of it were removed by Constantine.  

[TenSin]

Phaeton

TenSin

EXCELLENT! While on the subject of gravity (something you cannot SEE but can FEEL) why don't we bring this to the subject of God. You can't SEE God but (at least I and many other Christians) can FEEL Him. So you say there is scientific proof of gravity? What is gravity? Is it really a tangible peice of matter like you say it is? You don't know for sure do you? But you know it exists because things fall to the ground. This is the same thing as when someone asks a believer about God. The same questions can be asked about God, but what people don't know is that God is outside time and space. That is how He could create everything, because He doesn't have the limits that we do in this world. We "shove it down your throat" because we are humans too, and feel like we need to do too much, but God's plan is perfect and even if we, who try so desperately to save you, are rejected then later God can use what we say to remind you and somehow bring you back to Him. It's something some believers call "planting the seed" that God waters and eventually sprouts hopefully. Some people just try to plant it too hard. That's all. And on that note, I'll shut up.

The problem with that is Gravity actually has been proven. Hold up something and let it go. No matter how many times you hold up and let something go it's going to fall to the ground. Gravity is not a tangible piece of matter it is the principle that larger masses tend to attract smaller masses. It's unbelievably simple, and it's heavily supported with plenty of scientific evidence. It's a key in understanding how the planets and the sun formed as well.

Yahweh is not a principle, you can't actually prove Yahweh/Allah/Whoever the hell else you refer to as "God" exists. You can't prove that this deity exists outside of time and space, you can't even prove there is an "outside " of time and space.

Now pamplets and evangelists are irritating but at least those who follow can easily say no, but you have to admit events like the Spanish Inquisition and the Salem Witch Hunts crossed a line.

And for a historical document it's sort of odd that the Bible was written LONG after the death of christ, takes bits and pieces from multiple other pagan religions, was manipulated in order to keep American slaves in line, and even around 600 articles of it were removed by Constantine.

My point wasn't that it doesn't exist or that you can't prove that it exists, that would make me just be saying the same thing as you about God. My main point that I was going to get at was that you can't prove He doesn't exist. And I know how it affects the universe.
(I never even said Yaweh was a principle, where'd you get that from?) And you can't disprove that there is an outside time or space either. So why do you disown it so quickly.
And it wasn't written long after the death of Christ. The gospels were written within 20 years of Jesus' death, that isn't very long. The book of Luke was written by a doctor who acted like a historian in collecting information, so not only did he have his own eyewittness accounts, he had many other accounts to use as well. And you don't complain about historical books that were written hundreds of years after the event. It's probably coincidence that other religions share similar qualities to the Bible, you do seem to believe in coincidence a lot. The problem with the slave holders was them, not the Bible, same thing with the Spanish inquisition, so that proves nothing, only that the people did evil things. I haven't read about whatever you said about Constantine, I'll ask at church.  

[CainZeros]

TenSin

LimeyFish8

Angel of Music

Taka Seiyaryu

Angel of Music

Okay first of all God is a spirt now and he won't be back until the end of the world but he is here now for he is all around us.

I'm really sorry for what happened to you. Thats awful. But you can't blame God. God wasen't the one who abused you. Sometimes when you pray for something the answer doesn't come right away but if you keep having faith God will answer your prayers. Hes answered a lot of mine. I lost a best friend because I was to "good" for her taste. Guess what happened to her? She steals now and shes into some bad stuff.

All I can say is God died for you. There is the bible to prove it. And if your not greatful for that than thats to bad. If your gonna hold a grudge on God for something bad that happened in the past that wasen't even God's fault than thats to bad. I understand it must be harder for you to believe now but talk to your Christian friends, listen to them, open your mind. I'm not gonna try to force my opinion on you but I just feel it's to bad that after what happened to you, you can't be greatful that eventually you did get through it and have been blessed with a lot.

Oh, how convenient. Spirit, eh? Well then the least he could do is show his face to me in a dream or something. If he wants me to believe in him so bad he's got to prove he exists first. The Bible does nothing for him. In my eyes, it's just another work of fiction written ages ago. And, grateful for what? He didn't die. Jesus did, and he was nothing more than a prophet. I do not blame God for what happened to me. All I'm saying is praying to him does nothing for me. He doesn't want anything to do with me, apparently, so he has made no attempt to answer my prayers in any form or way.

Since he was nice enough to answer your prayers: good for you. He likes you. You can go hang out in Heaven and I'll go hang out in Hell and try to become a general like Azazel. 3nodding

Jesus was the son of God. God gave up his son. Which is hard. Sometimes answering prayers just takes time. But look at what you have now? Don't you think things have turned up. I can't make you believe or anything but there are answers to your questions and sometimes we just don't know and its a mystery as to why God doesn't always answer our prayers right away. I do know that he loves all of us equally. Including you.

Would a loving and caring, omnipotent diety allow half of the world to starve? Would it allow famine, pestilence, and war to tear countries and people apart? You say that it answers a lot of questions, that is what religion is for. Suspend, for a moment, your acceptance that there is a god and think about why religon would be invented with out one. Just think about that. This issue is so difficult to debate because neither side is willing to consider the possibility that the other might be right. I have spent a lot of time thinking about it and while saying that there is a god answers many many questions, but for me it doesn't answer them satisfactorily. Its a personal issue and in debate the impass that is most commonly reached is wether or not there is proof for either answer.

Usually it isn't God that allows people to starve, usually it's a human's own fault that he is starving or dying. God gave us free will. Humans abuse this and don't follow God's will. That is why there is war, and famine and disease. It's our own fault. In the Bible, things like that entered the world because of sin. So it's not God who is letting things like this happen, it is us who stubbornly refuse to let God guide them. It is a a difficult debate thought, you are right. But like I said people are stubborn and prideful. People don't want to admit they are wrong. And I don't mean to offend you but thinking that truth is a personal matter is very prideful indeed. I don't claim to know everyting, but I do know a very important singular truth that you probably know but don't accept. God says in the Bible that He created us with a knowledge of Him. So it annoys me when people say there is no God. It's because I know that God exists and He works in His ways, but people who don't know how to look for Him or haven't been shown how to see His work are the people who don't think He exists. If you read the Bible, and take time to understand it then you start to see how God takes care of us if we saty in His will. God takes care of me, I know that for sure. And I bet He takes care of you too, and everyone else.
Wow, that turned out pretty long but I think I needed to say it.

You say it's our fault but if there is a God and He's so merciful he could give the starving people a food source. And as for war, a lot of wars are started over religion. Disease is caused by germs, which are part of nature. If God exists He created them, thus killing a lot of us off with them. You say we're stubborn and prideful, you're every bit as stubborn and prideful as we are. It's human nature.  

[TenSin]

Mr.Ownage

TenSin

LimeyFish8

Angel of Music

Taka Seiyaryu

Angel of Music

Okay first of all God is a spirt now and he won't be back until the end of the world but he is here now for he is all around us.

I'm really sorry for what happened to you. Thats awful. But you can't blame God. God wasen't the one who abused you. Sometimes when you pray for something the answer doesn't come right away but if you keep having faith God will answer your prayers. Hes answered a lot of mine. I lost a best friend because I was to "good" for her taste. Guess what happened to her? She steals now and shes into some bad stuff.

All I can say is God died for you. There is the bible to prove it. And if your not greatful for that than thats to bad. If your gonna hold a grudge on God for something bad that happened in the past that wasen't even God's fault than thats to bad. I understand it must be harder for you to believe now but talk to your Christian friends, listen to them, open your mind. I'm not gonna try to force my opinion on you but I just feel it's to bad that after what happened to you, you can't be greatful that eventually you did get through it and have been blessed with a lot.

Oh, how convenient. Spirit, eh? Well then the least he could do is show his face to me in a dream or something. If he wants me to believe in him so bad he's got to prove he exists first. The Bible does nothing for him. In my eyes, it's just another work of fiction written ages ago. And, grateful for what? He didn't die. Jesus did, and he was nothing more than a prophet. I do not blame God for what happened to me. All I'm saying is praying to him does nothing for me. He doesn't want anything to do with me, apparently, so he has made no attempt to answer my prayers in any form or way.

Since he was nice enough to answer your prayers: good for you. He likes you. You can go hang out in Heaven and I'll go hang out in Hell and try to become a general like Azazel. 3nodding

Jesus was the son of God. God gave up his son. Which is hard. Sometimes answering prayers just takes time. But look at what you have now? Don't you think things have turned up. I can't make you believe or anything but there are answers to your questions and sometimes we just don't know and its a mystery as to why God doesn't always answer our prayers right away. I do know that he loves all of us equally. Including you.

Would a loving and caring, omnipotent diety allow half of the world to starve? Would it allow famine, pestilence, and war to tear countries and people apart? You say that it answers a lot of questions, that is what religion is for. Suspend, for a moment, your acceptance that there is a god and think about why religon would be invented with out one. Just think about that. This issue is so difficult to debate because neither side is willing to consider the possibility that the other might be right. I have spent a lot of time thinking about it and while saying that there is a god answers many many questions, but for me it doesn't answer them satisfactorily. Its a personal issue and in debate the impass that is most commonly reached is wether or not there is proof for either answer.

Usually it isn't God that allows people to starve, usually it's a human's own fault that he is starving or dying. God gave us free will. Humans abuse this and don't follow God's will. That is why there is war, and famine and disease. It's our own fault. In the Bible, things like that entered the world because of sin. So it's not God who is letting things like this happen, it is us who stubbornly refuse to let God guide them. It is a a difficult debate thought, you are right. But like I said people are stubborn and prideful. People don't want to admit they are wrong. And I don't mean to offend you but thinking that truth is a personal matter is very prideful indeed. I don't claim to know everyting, but I do know a very important singular truth that you probably know but don't accept. God says in the Bible that He created us with a knowledge of Him. So it annoys me when people say there is no God. It's because I know that God exists and He works in His ways, but people who don't know how to look for Him or haven't been shown how to see His work are the people who don't think He exists. If you read the Bible, and take time to understand it then you start to see how God takes care of us if we saty in His will. God takes care of me, I know that for sure. And I bet He takes care of you too, and everyone else.
Wow, that turned out pretty long but I think I needed to say it.

You say it's our fault but if there is a God and He's so merciful he could give the starving people a food source. And as for war, a lot of wars are started over religion. Disease is caused by germs, which are part of nature. If God exists He created them, thus killing a lot of us off with them. You say we're stubborn and prideful, you're every bit as stubborn and prideful as we are. It's human nature.

God is merciful yes, but He doesn't work like that in this day and age. He uses the people who believe in Him to do that, and if they don't then it's thier own fault, not God's. War is stupid mostly. We just kill each other and it doesn't solve anything until it's over. God doesn't wish for wars, the only time He did was in the Old Testament when He led the Israelites into the promised land (please don't turn this conversation into a Jew bashing/political conversation, I hate politics) Disease entered the world with sin, therfore it is man's fault that there is disease. I never said I wasn't prideful did I? I know it's human nature but I'm trying to fight against my human nature to make God happy. That's all.  

[CainZeros]

TenSin

Mr.Ownage

TenSin

LimeyFish8

Angel of Music

Jesus was the son of God. God gave up his son. Which is hard. Sometimes answering prayers just takes time. But look at what you have now? Don't you think things have turned up. I can't make you believe or anything but there are answers to your questions and sometimes we just don't know and its a mystery as to why God doesn't always answer our prayers right away. I do know that he loves all of us equally. Including you.

Would a loving and caring, omnipotent diety allow half of the world to starve? Would it allow famine, pestilence, and war to tear countries and people apart? You say that it answers a lot of questions, that is what religion is for. Suspend, for a moment, your acceptance that there is a god and think about why religon would be invented with out one. Just think about that. This issue is so difficult to debate because neither side is willing to consider the possibility that the other might be right. I have spent a lot of time thinking about it and while saying that there is a god answers many many questions, but for me it doesn't answer them satisfactorily. Its a personal issue and in debate the impass that is most commonly reached is wether or not there is proof for either answer.

Usually it isn't God that allows people to starve, usually it's a human's own fault that he is starving or dying. God gave us free will. Humans abuse this and don't follow God's will. That is why there is war, and famine and disease. It's our own fault. In the Bible, things like that entered the world because of sin. So it's not God who is letting things like this happen, it is us who stubbornly refuse to let God guide them. It is a a difficult debate thought, you are right. But like I said people are stubborn and prideful. People don't want to admit they are wrong. And I don't mean to offend you but thinking that truth is a personal matter is very prideful indeed. I don't claim to know everyting, but I do know a very important singular truth that you probably know but don't accept. God says in the Bible that He created us with a knowledge of Him. So it annoys me when people say there is no God. It's because I know that God exists and He works in His ways, but people who don't know how to look for Him or haven't been shown how to see His work are the people who don't think He exists. If you read the Bible, and take time to understand it then you start to see how God takes care of us if we saty in His will. God takes care of me, I know that for sure. And I bet He takes care of you too, and everyone else.
Wow, that turned out pretty long but I think I needed to say it.

You say it's our fault but if there is a God and He's so merciful he could give the starving people a food source. And as for war, a lot of wars are started over religion. Disease is caused by germs, which are part of nature. If God exists He created them, thus killing a lot of us off with them. You say we're stubborn and prideful, you're every bit as stubborn and prideful as we are. It's human nature.

God is merciful yes, but He doesn't work like that in this day and age. He uses the people who believe in Him to do that, and if they don't then it's thier own fault, not God's. War is stupid mostly. We just kill each other and it doesn't solve anything until it's over. God doesn't wish for wars, the only time He did was in the Old Testament when He led the Israelites into the promised land (please don't turn this conversation into a Jew bashing/political conversation, I hate politics) Disease entered the world with sin, therfore it is man's fault that there is disease. I never said I wasn't prideful did I? I know it's human nature but I'm trying to fight against my human nature to make God happy. That's all.

God may not wish for war but that doesn't change the fact that a lot of wars have been started over differences in religious beliefs. Not to mention all the religious genocide. Everyone thinks their religion is the one that's right. It's little wonder temples were being bombed in the Middle East only a month ago.  

[TenSin]

Mr.Ownage

TenSin

Mr.Ownage

TenSin

LimeyFish8

Angel of Music

Jesus was the son of God. God gave up his son. Which is hard. Sometimes answering prayers just takes time. But look at what you have now? Don't you think things have turned up. I can't make you believe or anything but there are answers to your questions and sometimes we just don't know and its a mystery as to why God doesn't always answer our prayers right away. I do know that he loves all of us equally. Including you.

Would a loving and caring, omnipotent diety allow half of the world to starve? Would it allow famine, pestilence, and war to tear countries and people apart? You say that it answers a lot of questions, that is what religion is for. Suspend, for a moment, your acceptance that there is a god and think about why religon would be invented with out one. Just think about that. This issue is so difficult to debate because neither side is willing to consider the possibility that the other might be right. I have spent a lot of time thinking about it and while saying that there is a god answers many many questions, but for me it doesn't answer them satisfactorily. Its a personal issue and in debate the impass that is most commonly reached is wether or not there is proof for either answer.

Usually it isn't God that allows people to starve, usually it's a human's own fault that he is starving or dying. God gave us free will. Humans abuse this and don't follow God's will. That is why there is war, and famine and disease. It's our own fault. In the Bible, things like that entered the world because of sin. So it's not God who is letting things like this happen, it is us who stubbornly refuse to let God guide them. It is a a difficult debate thought, you are right. But like I said people are stubborn and prideful. People don't want to admit they are wrong. And I don't mean to offend you but thinking that truth is a personal matter is very prideful indeed. I don't claim to know everyting, but I do know a very important singular truth that you probably know but don't accept. God says in the Bible that He created us with a knowledge of Him. So it annoys me when people say there is no God. It's because I know that God exists and He works in His ways, but people who don't know how to look for Him or haven't been shown how to see His work are the people who don't think He exists. If you read the Bible, and take time to understand it then you start to see how God takes care of us if we saty in His will. God takes care of me, I know that for sure. And I bet He takes care of you too, and everyone else.
Wow, that turned out pretty long but I think I needed to say it.

You say it's our fault but if there is a God and He's so merciful he could give the starving people a food source. And as for war, a lot of wars are started over religion. Disease is caused by germs, which are part of nature. If God exists He created them, thus killing a lot of us off with them. You say we're stubborn and prideful, you're every bit as stubborn and prideful as we are. It's human nature.

God is merciful yes, but He doesn't work like that in this day and age. He uses the people who believe in Him to do that, and if they don't then it's thier own fault, not God's. War is stupid mostly. We just kill each other and it doesn't solve anything until it's over. God doesn't wish for wars, the only time He did was in the Old Testament when He led the Israelites into the promised land (please don't turn this conversation into a Jew bashing/political conversation, I hate politics) Disease entered the world with sin, therfore it is man's fault that there is disease. I never said I wasn't prideful did I? I know it's human nature but I'm trying to fight against my human nature to make God happy. That's all.

God may not wish for war but that doesn't change the fact that a lot of wars have been started over differences in religious beliefs. Not to mention all the religious genocide. Everyone thinks their religion is the one that's right. It's little wonder temples were being bombed in the Middle East only a month ago.

That isn't any reason not to believe in God or that He doesn't exist. It just proves that human nature is evil. I've been saying that the whole time, jeez pay attention. And I really hate politics so let's not get into what's going on there please, it's just more human stupidity and sin.  

[CainZeros]

TenSin

Mr.Ownage

TenSin

Mr.Ownage

TenSin

Usually it isn't God that allows people to starve, usually it's a human's own fault that he is starving or dying. God gave us free will. Humans abuse this and don't follow God's will. That is why there is war, and famine and disease. It's our own fault. In the Bible, things like that entered the world because of sin. So it's not God who is letting things like this happen, it is us who stubbornly refuse to let God guide them. It is a a difficult debate thought, you are right. But like I said people are stubborn and prideful. People don't want to admit they are wrong. And I don't mean to offend you but thinking that truth is a personal matter is very prideful indeed. I don't claim to know everyting, but I do know a very important singular truth that you probably know but don't accept. God says in the Bible that He created us with a knowledge of Him. So it annoys me when people say there is no God. It's because I know that God exists and He works in His ways, but people who don't know how to look for Him or haven't been shown how to see His work are the people who don't think He exists. If you read the Bible, and take time to understand it then you start to see how God takes care of us if we saty in His will. God takes care of me, I know that for sure. And I bet He takes care of you too, and everyone else.
Wow, that turned out pretty long but I think I needed to say it.

You say it's our fault but if there is a God and He's so merciful he could give the starving people a food source. And as for war, a lot of wars are started over religion. Disease is caused by germs, which are part of nature. If God exists He created them, thus killing a lot of us off with them. You say we're stubborn and prideful, you're every bit as stubborn and prideful as we are. It's human nature.

God is merciful yes, but He doesn't work like that in this day and age. He uses the people who believe in Him to do that, and if they don't then it's thier own fault, not God's. War is stupid mostly. We just kill each other and it doesn't solve anything until it's over. God doesn't wish for wars, the only time He did was in the Old Testament when He led the Israelites into the promised land (please don't turn this conversation into a Jew bashing/political conversation, I hate politics) Disease entered the world with sin, therfore it is man's fault that there is disease. I never said I wasn't prideful did I? I know it's human nature but I'm trying to fight against my human nature to make God happy. That's all.

God may not wish for war but that doesn't change the fact that a lot of wars have been started over differences in religious beliefs. Not to mention all the religious genocide. Everyone thinks their religion is the one that's right. It's little wonder temples were being bombed in the Middle East only a month ago.

That isn't any reason not to believe in God or that He doesn't exist. It just proves that human nature is evil. I've been saying that the whole time, jeez pay attention. And I really hate politics so let's not get into what's going on there please, it's just more human stupidity and sin.

But if religion was good and true we'd all be able to tell which one's right and then we could have avoided all that crap. I'm not trying to change your beliefs, you obviously strongly believe what you believe and I respect you steadfastness. However, until I see some definate proof that can't be attributed to coincidence I'm remaining highly sceptical.  

[Katarra Bloodstone]

heart heart

These discussions all turn out the same way. Basically, you cannot prove God exists, but you cannot also prove that He doesn't. And everyone things they're right no matter what. whee

I think Jesus did live, and did die, and did perhaps arise - but as a spirit, not coming-back-from-the-dead-zombie stuff. I think that maybe the miracles he performed were exaggerated a bit. If you look at other cultures, their folklore and myths were based on real events, but exaggerated as well, for whatever purposes (to get a lesson across, or to make it more memorable, etc..)

While it's not the greatest piece of fiction ever written, I did enjoy The DaVinci Code. (I haven't seen the movie yet. :XP smile But, like most people, I know that it's nothing but that - fiction. I found the idea of Jesus having a child to be amusing, but that's it.

And, lastly, myself, I'm a Laveyan Satanist, not that it matters. :XP:

heart heart  

[Buttercup Scenester]

I believe in God, however, I don't believe in everything in the Bible. For example, the way humans were created, the way the earth was created, all the little rules people are supposed to follow. I don't even go to church.

So I wouldn't dare call myself a Christian.

However, I'm not an Atheist, because I do believe in some kind of God.  

[TenSin]

Mr.Ownage

TenSin

Mr.Ownage

TenSin

Mr.Ownage

TenSin

Usually it isn't God that allows people to starve, usually it's a human's own fault that he is starving or dying. God gave us free will. Humans abuse this and don't follow God's will. That is why there is war, and famine and disease. It's our own fault. In the Bible, things like that entered the world because of sin. So it's not God who is letting things like this happen, it is us who stubbornly refuse to let God guide them. It is a a difficult debate thought, you are right. But like I said people are stubborn and prideful. People don't want to admit they are wrong. And I don't mean to offend you but thinking that truth is a personal matter is very prideful indeed. I don't claim to know everyting, but I do know a very important singular truth that you probably know but don't accept. God says in the Bible that He created us with a knowledge of Him. So it annoys me when people say there is no God. It's because I know that God exists and He works in His ways, but people who don't know how to look for Him or haven't been shown how to see His work are the people who don't think He exists. If you read the Bible, and take time to understand it then you start to see how God takes care of us if we saty in His will. God takes care of me, I know that for sure. And I bet He takes care of you too, and everyone else.
Wow, that turned out pretty long but I think I needed to say it.

You say it's our fault but if there is a God and He's so merciful he could give the starving people a food source. And as for war, a lot of wars are started over religion. Disease is caused by germs, which are part of nature. If God exists He created them, thus killing a lot of us off with them. You say we're stubborn and prideful, you're every bit as stubborn and prideful as we are. It's human nature.

God is merciful yes, but He doesn't work like that in this day and age. He uses the people who believe in Him to do that, and if they don't then it's thier own fault, not God's. War is stupid mostly. We just kill each other and it doesn't solve anything until it's over. God doesn't wish for wars, the only time He did was in the Old Testament when He led the Israelites into the promised land (please don't turn this conversation into a Jew bashing/political conversation, I hate politics) Disease entered the world with sin, therfore it is man's fault that there is disease. I never said I wasn't prideful did I? I know it's human nature but I'm trying to fight against my human nature to make God happy. That's all.

God may not wish for war but that doesn't change the fact that a lot of wars have been started over differences in religious beliefs. Not to mention all the religious genocide. Everyone thinks their religion is the one that's right. It's little wonder temples were being bombed in the Middle East only a month ago.

That isn't any reason not to believe in God or that He doesn't exist. It just proves that human nature is evil. I've been saying that the whole time, jeez pay attention. And I really hate politics so let's not get into what's going on there please, it's just more human stupidity and sin.

But if religion was good and true we'd all be able to tell which one's right and then we could have avoided all that crap. I'm not trying to change your beliefs, you obviously strongly believe what you believe and I respect you steadfastness. However, until I see some definate proof that can't be attributed to coincidence I'm remaining highly sceptical.

That isn't what Christianity is about. So until you have a change of mind, this is pointless for me to tell you these things.