Official SERIOUS Naruto Anime and Manga discussion

[Syndactyly]

liz_bliz

Shikalee

Uchiha Kagai

Shikalee

@ Uchiha Kagai: Unless Kishimoto has changed the rules of the undead, no. Only the spell caster can inflict damage. Plus, even if Asuma could, it would be useless; Hidan is immortal and he is not.

So you say after you've read 235, when I made my theory before it came out.

No... So I say after reading many books about the undead...

actually, when it comes to hellspawn, cutting off their heads does actually kill them.

I wasn't talking about Hellspawn, because Hidan was never in hell, so far as we know. He creates his own ritual, making him far more like a necromancer.

Hellspawn = SPAWN of hell; hence the spawn in the name
Necromancer = Self-sustained controller of minons (usually the undead)

Necromancers generally deal with the dead, bit there are times where they will take control of, and harm, living vessels.

The Hellspawn are controlled by Malebolgia, the supreme master of Hell, and are mainly used as an officer corps for his army of hell, although they were not created by Malebolgia and existed before him. Hellspawns are infused with dark energy, called necroplasm, when they are created, but this power is finite when outside of hell.

Most Hellspawns were once human, but were tricked into making a bargain with Malebolgia; He would agree to return them to Earth, if they promise to return later on and become a Lieutenant in his army of Hell. This deal usually backfires on the person, as Malebolgia normally sends them several years (or decades) into the future, after their deaths and clad in the Hellspawn's symbiotic armor. Their time on Earth is also limited, as it is tied to their limited energy source. Each time a hellspawn uses his powers outside of Hell, the clock which represents his energy, counts down by one click. When the clock reaches zero, the hellspawn will automatically return to hell.

Hellspawn come with the, "selling your soul to the Devil" concept; Hidan feels pleasure, he has a soul... We've all seen it, in it's grossness. Those wihtout souls have no true emotion, nor can they perform it, because they have forgotten how it feels to have emotion and sensations. Those without souls literally, feel nothing.

For examples, Vampires do not feel pain or pleasure. So Buffy, Blade, etc are big lies right there for entertainement. Vampires are forever suffering in their minds because they cannot feel plan, pleasure, happiness, sadness. They are completely empty; always hungry for human interaction. But they are no longer human, so that desire is sin to them. They deny it.

Hidan, being from a Japanese manga, is probably an undead I haven't heard of... Because my study was primarily other sorts of undead. Japanese history is one of the things I know little about.  

[Syndactyly]

liz_bliz

I'm just pissed that mr.genuis Shikamaru has figured out why Hidan's imortal yet, cause I want to fricken know, the suspense is killing me.

Because it requires knowledge.

Shikamaru runs off logic, some emotion, and a little expirience. He has almost no actual knowledge, except for the traps of Ninjutsu. Never have we seen him be actually smart, pulling true information from his mind. He is merely a pawn to run information through, unfortunately. Being as, "lazy" as he is, he never takes the time to learn new things. He waits until the last minute and that is why he panics.

MAYBE Shikaku could figure it out. MAYBE. But knowing Akatsuki, that might not even be the REAL Hidan. Switching bodies and such... we never know. We don't even know if he's full man, seeing puppets and such all over the place. The only way they could really know is to kill him, take his body and things, and study those. As we all know, Shikamaru isn't much of a studier, though he is an observer. He can see every detail, but cannot necessarily put one and two together because he lacks wisdom and knowledge.

That is why I hate Shikamaru missconceptions; he's FAR from perfect.  

[Captain Verd]

Seriously. I mean yes, he figures alot of things out, but he's not just going to randomly discover Hidan's means of NO HURTY LOLZ no jutsu.

That said, I don't think Shikaku's a big genius like Shikamaru.  

[Syndactyly]

Captain Verd

Seriously. I mean yes, he figures alot of things out, but he's not just going to randomly discover Hidan's means of NO HURTY LOLZ no jutsu.

That said, I don't think Shikaku's a big genius like Shikamaru.

He is. xd His dad is almost exactly like him; except more, "manly." *ROFLS AT THE PUN* rofl

No, seriously. They are very much the same. His dad writes the books Tsunade uses to heal people.  

[Captain Verd]

Where'd you get that?  

[Syndactyly]

Captain Verd

Where'd you get that?

Why, a fangirl who doesn't know enough? Shikamaru p***s envy? No? Too bad. I'm telling you anyway.

I do character analysis. Primarily for a while I surrounded it around the Nara family. Shikamaru's embarassment to girls suggests he is ashamed of how his father acts around his mother, and how his mother treats his father. Showing signs of immaturity throughout his life, yet, at the same time being considered genius, it is pretty likely that he uses the emotions as a distraction; or lack thereof. He says obnoxious things to digress from the point. He inherited this weakness from his father.

Tidbits of info concerning his father's life are scattered throughout the series. There are brief conversations between him and Ino and Chouji's dads, and there are referances about him from them. He also is treated with respect by Tsunade, the 5th Hokage, which suggests that he had gained this respect. Shikaku writes the primary sources for medical ninjutsu. His books saved Lee's life, Chouji's life, and Neji's life. Likely, many other lives. No Joe-Schmoe could write such medical texts; medical texts that a woman such as Tsunade can find herself depending on. Therefore, he is some sort of intelligent one way or another. The respect people give him is not something he got from his son.

Shikamaru may have been through something to lead him to have sexual complexes. Or not. Either way, something in his life turned him away from those sensations. He, "hates" girls. But oh, he's not gay, either! It's obvious that he is hiding some rooted feelings. His father tells him that he needs to grow up. That, "without women, there would be no men." That his wife, "Is powerful yet soothing." He wants to teach Shikamaru these lessions. How does Shikaku know that Shikamaru is suffering inner conflict, rather than being just an immature boy? Besides the fact it's lasted so long, he also understands, because he probably went through it. No one else understands that. Most of them don't even notice or care about it because Shikamaru's intelligence is so distracting from anything that might be wrong with him. I said this one and I'll say it again; he's far from perfect.

It goes far deeper than that, but I'm short on time. I got to go take a shower.  

[liz_bliz_inc]

Shikalee

liz_bliz

Shikalee

Uchiha Kagai

Shikalee

@ Uchiha Kagai: Unless Kishimoto has changed the rules of the undead, no. Only the spell caster can inflict damage. Plus, even if Asuma could, it would be useless; Hidan is immortal and he is not.

So you say after you've read 235, when I made my theory before it came out.

No... So I say after reading many books about the undead...

actually, when it comes to hellspawn, cutting off their heads does actually kill them.

I wasn't talking about Hellspawn, because Hidan was never in hell, so far as we know. He creates his own ritual, making him far more like a necromancer.

Hellspawn = SPAWN of hell; hence the spawn in the name
Necromancer = Self-sustained controller of minons (usually the undead)

Necromancers generally deal with the dead, bit there are times where they will take control of, and harm, living vessels.

The Hellspawn are controlled by Malebolgia, the supreme master of Hell, and are mainly used as an officer corps for his army of hell, although they were not created by Malebolgia and existed before him. Hellspawns are infused with dark energy, called necroplasm, when they are created, but this power is finite when outside of hell.

Most Hellspawns were once human, but were tricked into making a bargain with Malebolgia; He would agree to return them to Earth, if they promise to return later on and become a Lieutenant in his army of Hell. This deal usually backfires on the person, as Malebolgia normally sends them several years (or decades) into the future, after their deaths and clad in the Hellspawn's symbiotic armor. Their time on Earth is also limited, as it is tied to their limited energy source. Each time a hellspawn uses his powers outside of Hell, the clock which represents his energy, counts down by one click. When the clock reaches zero, the hellspawn will automatically return to hell.

Hellspawn come with the, "selling your soul to the Devil" concept; Hidan feels pleasure, he has a soul... We've all seen it, in it's grossness. Those wihtout souls have no true emotion, nor can they perform it, because they have forgotten how it feels to have emotion and sensations. Those without souls literally, feel nothing.

For examples, Vampires do not feel pain or pleasure. So Buffy, Blade, etc are big lies right there for entertainement. Vampires are forever suffering in their minds because they cannot feel plan, pleasure, happiness, sadness. They are completely empty; always hungry for human interaction. But they are no longer human, so that desire is sin to them. They deny it.

Hidan, being from a Japanese manga, is probably an undead I haven't heard of... Because my study was primarily other sorts of undead. Japanese history is one of the things I know little about.

hell spawn does not only mean THE Spawn, but other things as well. For starters, the violator from the same series.

Vampires are hellspawn, as are zombies. At least they are in most lore, cutting of a vamp's head usually kills them, and is on a short list of the ways you can.

Last I checked though, Buffy was a vampire slayer....different from vampires themselves. As for the few vamps in that series that are 'nice' they mention that they got there souls back.

As for blade, at leas tint he movies, they treat being a vampire, and vampirism, as not something to do with hell and soul selling, but that is but something that infects the body, a virus, that has a cure.


That's why lcyhans are the hsit and you all know it, no soul selling for us damnit!  

[liz_bliz_inc]

Shikalee

liz_bliz

I'm just pissed that mr.genuis Shikamaru has figured out why Hidan's imortal yet, cause I want to fricken know, the suspense is killing me.

Because it requires knowledge.

Shikamaru runs off logic, some emotion, and a little expirience. He has almost no actual knowledge, except for the traps of Ninjutsu. Never have we seen him be actually smart, pulling true information from his mind. He is merely a pawn to run information through, unfortunately. Being as, "lazy" as he is, he never takes the time to learn new things. He waits until the last minute and that is why he panics.

MAYBE Shikaku could figure it out. MAYBE. But knowing Akatsuki, that might not even be the REAL Hidan. Switching bodies and such... we never know. We don't even know if he's full man, seeing puppets and such all over the place. The only way they could really know is to kill him, take his body and things, and study those. As we all know, Shikamaru isn't much of a studier, though he is an observer. He can see every detail, but cannot necessarily put one and two together because he lacks wisdom and knowledge.

That is why I hate Shikamaru missconceptions; he's FAR from perfect.

having an IQ of over 200 tends to help in the whole problem solving thing. He should be able to figure things out faster, on less information than others, which is why I thought it was stupid that it took him that long to figure out how Hidan's jutsu worked, I had it after about 3 second after Asuma's jutsu got himself burned.

and I'd rather not get into his emotion complexes, they have nothing to do with this particular bit of the debate.  

[Syndactyly]

liz_bliz

hell spawn does not only mean THE Spawn, but other things as well. For starters, the violator from the same series.

Vampires are hellspawn, as are zombies. At least they are in most lore, cutting of a vamp's head usually kills them, and is on a short list of the ways you can.

Last I checked though, Buffy was a vampire slayer....different from vampires themselves. As for the few vamps in that series that are 'nice' they mention that they got there souls back.

As for blade, at leas tint he movies, they treat being a vampire, and vampirism, as not something to do with hell and soul selling, but that is but something that infects the body, a virus, that has a cure.


That's why lcyhans are the hsit and you all know it, no soul selling for us damnit!

I wasn't saying the spawn. I was saying any spawn. Hidan is self-susstaining and therefore that itself eliminates the possibility of him being a spawn of anything.

Vampires spawned from Dracula, Zombies spawed through a cursed being. They were spawned; you have to die to be spawned, as far as I recall.

I never said she was a vampire. I was referring the the name of the show. Just like saying, "Naruto is full of ninjas." It doesn't mean a ton of ninjas are packed in the boy's entrails.

Blade makes vampire killing look easy. It also makes vampires look alive; Vampires are unable to display emotion. Period.  

[Syndactyly]

liz_bliz

Shikalee

liz_bliz

I'm just pissed that mr.genuis Shikamaru has figured out why Hidan's imortal yet, cause I want to fricken know, the suspense is killing me.

Because it requires knowledge.

Shikamaru runs off logic, some emotion, and a little expirience. He has almost no actual knowledge, except for the traps of Ninjutsu. Never have we seen him be actually smart, pulling true information from his mind. He is merely a pawn to run information through, unfortunately. Being as, "lazy" as he is, he never takes the time to learn new things. He waits until the last minute and that is why he panics.

MAYBE Shikaku could figure it out. MAYBE. But knowing Akatsuki, that might not even be the REAL Hidan. Switching bodies and such... we never know. We don't even know if he's full man, seeing puppets and such all over the place. The only way they could really know is to kill him, take his body and things, and study those. As we all know, Shikamaru isn't much of a studier, though he is an observer. He can see every detail, but cannot necessarily put one and two together because he lacks wisdom and knowledge.

That is why I hate Shikamaru missconceptions; he's FAR from perfect.

having an IQ of over 200 tends to help in the whole problem solving thing. He should be able to figure things out faster, on less information than others, which is why I thought it was stupid that it took him that long to figure out how Hidan's jutsu worked, I had it after about 3 second after Asuma's jutsu got himself burned.

and I'd rather not get into his emotion complexes, they have nothing to do with this particular bit of the debate.

It's not over 200.

First of all, he never took a REAL IQ test. Asuma made an assumption based off of Shikamaru's behaviors displayed in several games/puzzles. Second, 200 is as high as it goes. No one in any of our lifetimes has ever reached 200. Stephen Hawking is estimated to have around 170. Shikamaru is no scientist, philosopher, or anything. Asuma's fantasies were never fact... he blew it far out of proportion. Nevertheless, Shikamaru IS still very smart.

Shikamaru cannot find something out without any knowledge in that area. He cannot think that up out of nowhere, assuming the history of undead, the facts of undead, etc. He has to actually know something about it. It's not that he requires less information; it is that he is more observant, and sees more information to use to determine a solution or what the actual situation is or requires. It didn't take him that long; if you read the 3 chapters in a row, it's not even a minute. It seems long because the comics come out each week. In, "real time" it really wasn't that long. You're exagirrating because you probably didn't take the time to read the segment as a whole. I have, and I fully understand the time duration througout the battle. I think the fight was too quick. Shikamaru thought about it for... 3 frames, and figured it out. OOOH. ONE PAGE. It hadn't even occured to him until then, or, I should say, he didn't need to know until then. It wasn't Shikamaru's fault that Asuma was harmed; it was the fact that they're fighting two Akatsuki members. It's hard enough to take one. When Kakuzu joined in, it was pretty much a lost cause. The only reason they survived was because reinforcements arrived, and the only reason they, and the reinforcements aren't dead, is because the Akatsuki leader is calling on Hidan telepathically.

I only mentioned emotion once. You obviously didn't read the post. Comtempulation is far from emotion. It's separating the possibilities, looking at them in different possibilities, and then putting together a logical decision or idea. Look at the possibilities; don't assume it's just ONE thing.  

[liz_bliz_inc]

Shikalee

liz_bliz

hell spawn does not only mean THE Spawn, but other things as well. For starters, the violator from the same series.

Vampires are hellspawn, as are zombies. At least they are in most lore, cutting of a vamp's head usually kills them, and is on a short list of the ways you can.

Last I checked though, Buffy was a vampire slayer....different from vampires themselves. As for the few vamps in that series that are 'nice' they mention that they got there souls back.

As for blade, at leas tint he movies, they treat being a vampire, and vampirism, as not something to do with hell and soul selling, but that is but something that infects the body, a virus, that has a cure.


That's why lcyhans are the hsit and you all know it, no soul selling for us damnit!

I wasn't saying the spawn. I was saying any spawn. Hidan is self-susstaining and therefore that itself eliminates the possibility of him being a spawn of anything.

Vampires spawned from Dracula, Zombies spawed through a cursed being. They were spawned; you have to die to be spawned, as far as I recall.

I never said she was a vampire. I was referring the the name of the show. Just like saying, "Naruto is full of ninjas." It doesn't mean a ton of ninjas are packed in the boy's entrails.

Blade makes vampire killing look easy. It also makes vampires look alive; Vampires are unable to display emotion. Period.

never said that's how I see vampires, just how they were pertrayed in the Blade movies.  

[liz_bliz_inc]

actually, I think it took a full chapter for him to realize it.

The chapter ended right after Asuma got hit with a back lash I believe. Then there was a lengthly little thing leading up to the part where Hidan stabed his own knee.

Then Shikamaru used his shadwo tech to stop Hidan from moving, still not yet nowing how the jutsu worked. Then the chapter ended with him finally finguring it out and starting to move Hidan out of the circle.

I'd have to check to be sure.

as for the highest IQs, you'd be wrong there, for starters, Albert Einstien's (sp?) IQ was recorded at about 165. Hell, Ben Franklin's was estimate at about 160.

there are different tests with different scales, some only go to 200, some go to 300, so you would have to adjust what those scores ment accordingly.

No, Hawking's is above 200 on almost any test he takes that goes to 300.

BUT, he is not the smartest person alive, Marilyn vos Savant is, she has a pretty steady IQ of 228, sometimes higher.  

[liz_bliz_inc]

by the way, I'd put the length of time it took Shikamaru to figure it out at about 2 minutes max, 1 1/2 min.

Obviously still impressive, but he's supposed to be smarter than me. And the fact that no one else could figure it out at all is what got me, it was pretty blarringly obvious that he was up to something strange as soon as he stopped attacking after he drew blood from Asuma and finished drawling the circle, dead give aways there.  

[Syndactyly]

liz_bliz

actually, I think it took a full chapter for him to realize it.

The chapter ended right after Asuma got hit with a back lash I believe. Then there was a lengthly little thing leading up to the part where Hidan stabed his own knee.

Then Shikamaru used his shadwo tech to stop Hidan from moving, still not yet nowing how the jutsu worked. Then the chapter ended with him finally finguring it out and starting to move Hidan out of the circle.

I'd have to check to be sure.

as for the highest IQs, you'd be wrong there, for starters, Albert Einstien's (sp?) IQ was recorded at about 165. Hell, Ben Franklin's was estimate at about 160.

there are different tests with different scales, some only go to 200, some go to 300, so you would have to adjust what those scores ment accordingly.

No, Hawking's is above 200 on almost any test he takes that goes to 300.

BUT, he is not the smartest person alive, Marilyn vos Savant is, she has a pretty steady IQ of 228, sometimes higher.

No. I can post it if you want.

Shikamaru's all like, "Oh noes gotta think fast."

Shikamaru did not do that to stop him from moving. The shadow is pretty slow; he was pull him out of the circle the whole time. He knew it was the circle as soon as he said, "Ikuze Asuma" which was way before he even used kage kubi shibari. surprised

No, I'm not wrong there. IQ has changed a lot since tose people were alive.

IQ officially goes up to 200. Don't be a dunce. Yes, on lightly waited tests it goes to 300, 400, or even 500. But that is not the national number. It is 200 and if you want to keep arguing it post a goddamn source. The scale is only larger for more accurate numbers. But the SCALE is 200. So a 235 on a 300 scale would be 156, which yes, is extraordinarily high. IQ is determined on a bell curve, therefore, the mass majority inches towards the middle. Honestly, you can't even find one that says 300. If 300 existed, 200 would be on the map of possibility. If people with 300 existed, it would be on the chart. You've given a name, and I'm sure you can pull more out your a**. If this is true, you can find a chart with 300 on it. At least with 250 on it.

http://images.google.com/images?tab=vi&sa=N&btnG=Google+Search&q=IQ Bell Curve&hl=en

No one can determine who the smartest person alive is, which makes me think you're even dumber. Stop digging yourself in a hole of idiocy, and stop defending things I can prove WRONG.  

[Syndactyly]

liz_bliz

by the way, I'd put the length of time it took Shikamaru to figure it out at about 2 minutes max, 1 1/2 min.

Obviously still impressive, but he's supposed to be smarter than me. And the fact that no one else could figure it out at all is what got me, it was pretty blarringly obvious that he was up to something strange as soon as he stopped attacking after he drew blood from Asuma and finished drawling the circle, dead give aways there.

What the ******** are you, a stalker? First of all, it's timed by the JAPANESE version. The English duration is far different. Second, pauses are determined by the READER. Third, I don't think even Kishimoto knows, because frankly, only those with Shikamaru p***s ENVY would give a damn.

He's smarter than you by far. You haven't said one thing in this thread that was right... Except about Naruto. OOOOOH YOU'RE SO SMART YOU CAN GET AN ANIME. Get over yourself. You're not the smartest person here... That other dude is. Think of Shikamaru's goddamn situation. He was probably tense. A thinker myself, I know that when you're tense, it's harder to think. It's harder to make wise decisions. Shikamaru was in a sort of panic, especially certain that he, and his companions would die. You're one hunk of an egotistical a** if you think every last thing that happened was obvious. In Japan, yes, WHERE ALL THE NERDS STUDY NARUTO RELIGIOUSLY, no one (in our seperate Naruto-deticated forums) figured it out until the chapter after that. I didn't figure it out until Shikamaru said, "There's got to be a weakness." I immediately thought the circle. So yeah. It was sort of obvious; CONSIDERING ITS A KIDS MANGA. It's written in HIRAGANA for Christ's sake! People should stop worshipping Shikamaru, and the other characters, religiously.

Emotionless =/= Intelligent
Emotions are included in one's broad understanding. So being, "controlled" doesn't make you smarter than him, it makes you Spock-like.