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 Posted: Sun Dec 17, 2006 9:09 am
Shikalee I don't think the story needs to have a point. I think you guys are reading into this a little too deeply. It's a comic book for kid's for christ's sake. You don't think a story needs to have a point?
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Posted: Sun Dec 17, 2006 10:38 am
mofoslotmachine Shikalee I don't think the story needs to have a point. I think you guys are reading into this a little too deeply. It's a comic book for kid's for christ's sake. You don't think a story needs to have a point? No. It doesn't. xd Literature does not have to go, "This book was written to do, BLANK." A book is written because an author has an idea. Harry Potter wasn't written to bring magic into our hearts. J.K. Rowling had an AWESOME idea and she put it into a book. An excellent example of this is Chronicle of a Death Foretold. The book was all about one man's death. The only purpose it served was really providing a new type of writing. The story's value had little bearing, except the fact that it made several political statements about the Colombian revolution. Naruto doesn't have to be about HOPE, COURAGE, whatever. A book doesn't REQUIRE a theme, though it may have one. Themes depend on the BOOK, but the book is INDEPENDENT of the themes. Naruto could lose hope and die and then what? Not likely, but it is still possible. It is pretty rash to say NARUTO MEANS THIS when none of you wrote the story, nor know where it's going.
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Posted: Sun Dec 17, 2006 10:42 am
attilathefun Shikalee I don't think the story needs to have a point. I think you guys are reading into this a little too deeply. It's a comic book for kid's for christ's sake. Probably Kishimoto isn't writing it with a "point" in mind; he's just writing and that's the way it comes out; it's only the point (at least in my opinion) because practically everyone in the comic overcomes adversity like...all the time. Kishimoto makes a big deal out of it. Then, when he rushes it, as it seems like he's doing now, the adversities get compacted and it's fight fight fight BLAH BLAH BLAH and it becomes a mushy, nasty cold oatmeal casserole of no character development unless it will help him FIGHT TEH BAD GUYZ. Exception being Shikamaru's boring, predictable 'I am now super-serious' reaction to Asuma's death. But I guess I wouldn't really call that character growth. edited because I forgot to say things. xd I think the "point" if we want to view it that was is growth. This story displays large amounts of change, and we always expect change throughout the story. Some stories aren't like that. Like Dragonball. xd He isn't rushing. You guys don't know ANYTHING about how he writes or his schedule. He isn't behind; in fact, he's way ahead. He has a team of people helping him ink and such so it doesn't have to be rushed. Like any mangaka, Kishimoto has the whole story already written down. He isn't making it up as he goes along. Kishimoto's work is weeks ahead. It's why he's been on so many vacations. It's why when he writes letters to us, it's about what he's been doing. I've never seen him write about how behind he was. I think you guys are just singling him out. It's pretty odd. First of all, he was always a pretty serious guy. He doesn't lie, and we never see him really unwind. Sure, he's relaxed. But have you ever seen him laugh?
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Posted: Sun Dec 17, 2006 10:50 am
Shikalee mofoslotmachine Shikalee I don't think the story needs to have a point. I think you guys are reading into this a little too deeply. It's a comic book for kid's for christ's sake. You don't think a story needs to have a point? No. It doesn't. xd Literature does not have to go, "This book was written to do, BLANK." A book is written because an author has an idea. Harry Potter wasn't written to bring magic into our hearts. J.K. Rowling had an AWESOME idea and she put it into a book. An excellent example of this is Chronicle of a Death Foretold. The book was all about one man's death. The only purpose it served was really providing a new type of writing. The story's value had little bearing, except the fact that it made several political statements about the Colombian revolution. Naruto doesn't have to be about HOPE, COURAGE, whatever. A book doesn't REQUIRE a theme, though it may have one. Themes depend on the BOOK, but the book is INDEPENDENT of the themes. Naruto could lose hope and die and then what? Not likely, but it is still possible. It is pretty rash to say NARUTO MEANS THIS when none of you wrote the story, nor know where it's going. Points don't hve to be 'read between the lines' type of points. The point of Naruto could simply be LOOK NINJAS, and nothing more. Kind of like porn, you know? It's only point is boobies, but it still has a point.
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Posted: Sun Dec 17, 2006 11:38 am
Captain Verd Shikalee mofoslotmachine Shikalee I don't think the story needs to have a point. I think you guys are reading into this a little too deeply. It's a comic book for kid's for christ's sake. You don't think a story needs to have a point? No. It doesn't. xd Literature does not have to go, "This book was written to do, BLANK." A book is written because an author has an idea. Harry Potter wasn't written to bring magic into our hearts. J.K. Rowling had an AWESOME idea and she put it into a book. An excellent example of this is Chronicle of a Death Foretold. The book was all about one man's death. The only purpose it served was really providing a new type of writing. The story's value had little bearing, except the fact that it made several political statements about the Colombian revolution. Naruto doesn't have to be about HOPE, COURAGE, whatever. A book doesn't REQUIRE a theme, though it may have one. Themes depend on the BOOK, but the book is INDEPENDENT of the themes. Naruto could lose hope and die and then what? Not likely, but it is still possible. It is pretty rash to say NARUTO MEANS THIS when none of you wrote the story, nor know where it's going. Points don't hve to be 'read between the lines' type of points. The point of Naruto could simply be LOOK NINJAS, and nothing more. Kind of like porn, you know? It's only point is boobies, but it still has a point. Your points are, though. Read in between the lines... they're complete and utter assumptions because there are a NUMBER of things that could be the "point." Porn USUALLY has a storyline. Good porn, anyway.
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Posted: Sun Dec 17, 2006 11:53 am
Shikalee mofoslotmachine Shikalee I don't think the story needs to have a point. I think you guys are reading into this a little too deeply. It's a comic book for kid's for christ's sake. You don't think a story needs to have a point? No. It doesn't. xd Literature does not have to go, "This book was written to do, BLANK." A book is written because an author has an idea. Harry Potter wasn't written to bring magic into our hearts. J.K. Rowling had an AWESOME idea and she put it into a book. An excellent example of this is Chronicle of a Death Foretold. The book was all about one man's death. The only purpose it served was really providing a new type of writing. The story's value had little bearing, except the fact that it made several political statements about the Colombian revolution. Naruto doesn't have to be about HOPE, COURAGE, whatever. A book doesn't REQUIRE a theme, though it may have one. Themes depend on the BOOK, but the book is INDEPENDENT of the themes. Naruto could lose hope and die and then what? Not likely, but it is still possible. It is pretty rash to say NARUTO MEANS THIS when none of you wrote the story, nor know where it's going. "Except the fact that it made several political statements" -- you don't think this is some kind of point? Most literature is usually written with some point in mind, and I think you're misunderstanding what I mean when I say "point". I don't mean stuff like bringing magic into people's hearts, I mean more along the idea of themes and things of significance. HP wasn't written to bring magic into people's hearts, it's just a story about an underdog and a boy growing up and realising his strength, etc. Usually you can pinpoint a theme, and things that run contrary to that theme are unlikely to happen in the storyline. Naruto is all about hope, and even though it doesn't HAVE to be, it has been written that way. It's a pretty typical underdog story: Naruto started out at the bottom (no friends, no family, no real strength) and his tenacity and unwavering hope made him strong, blah blah blah. Having him suddenly get bitten in the neck by an angry Pakkun and dying would be surprising, and would show the dangers of ninja society, etc. etc., but it wouldn't appeal to most readers at all. If that was the way the series ended, I can hazard a guess that most people would be pissed off because there would be so many loose ends left. That's all I mean. Fiction isn't like reality; fiction can't just have everybody die in an avalanche in the end unless it makes sense in the context of the story.
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Posted: Sun Dec 17, 2006 12:30 pm
I am afraid they may kill kakashi because he is a lil too pimp, I mean everyone loves him, but the show is called Naruto. I wonder why the parents are not sent out to fight??? They have to be hella strong one would think. gonk
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Posted: Sun Dec 17, 2006 12:53 pm
SeiryokuX I am afraid they may kill kakashi because he is a lil too pimp, I mean everyone loves him, but the show is called Naruto. I wonder why the parents are not sent out to fight??? They have to be hella strong one would think. gonk Retired Jounins? XDDD Although the old Ino-Shika-Chou team helped during the war with Suna(Sand) and Oto(Sound).
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Posted: Sun Dec 17, 2006 3:09 pm
mofoslotmachine Shikalee mofoslotmachine Shikalee I don't think the story needs to have a point. I think you guys are reading into this a little too deeply. It's a comic book for kid's for christ's sake. You don't think a story needs to have a point? No. It doesn't. xd Literature does not have to go, "This book was written to do, BLANK." A book is written because an author has an idea. Harry Potter wasn't written to bring magic into our hearts. J.K. Rowling had an AWESOME idea and she put it into a book. An excellent example of this is Chronicle of a Death Foretold. The book was all about one man's death. The only purpose it served was really providing a new type of writing. The story's value had little bearing, except the fact that it made several political statements about the Colombian revolution. Naruto doesn't have to be about HOPE, COURAGE, whatever. A book doesn't REQUIRE a theme, though it may have one. Themes depend on the BOOK, but the book is INDEPENDENT of the themes. Naruto could lose hope and die and then what? Not likely, but it is still possible. It is pretty rash to say NARUTO MEANS THIS when none of you wrote the story, nor know where it's going. "Except the fact that it made several political statements" -- you don't think this is some kind of point? Most literature is usually written with some point in mind, and I think you're misunderstanding what I mean when I say "point". I don't mean stuff like bringing magic into people's hearts, I mean more along the idea of themes and things of significance. HP wasn't written to bring magic into people's hearts, it's just a story about an underdog and a boy growing up and realising his strength, etc. Usually you can pinpoint a theme, and things that run contrary to that theme are unlikely to happen in the storyline. Naruto is all about hope, and even though it doesn't HAVE to be, it has been written that way. It's a pretty typical underdog story: Naruto started out at the bottom (no friends, no family, no real strength) and his tenacity and unwavering hope made him strong, blah blah blah. Having him suddenly get bitten in the neck by an angry Pakkun and dying would be surprising, and would show the dangers of ninja society, etc. etc., but it wouldn't appeal to most readers at all. If that was the way the series ended, I can hazard a guess that most people would be pissed off because there would be so many loose ends left. That's all I mean. Fiction isn't like reality; fiction can't just have everybody die in an avalanche in the end unless it makes sense in the context of the story. But in contrast to your guesses that Naruto is about HOPE is completely different. Making a STATEMENT and playing a ROLE are two entirely different things. You're only saying theme because I brought it up. >_>; Harry Potter does have a theme, but it has nothing to do with strength and all that bull. You don't have a clue what a literary feature such as theme is, do you? If you don't, it's okay. Just don't pretend you do. Because that's annoying. As far as underlying stories go, you're completely assuming. Kishimoto never said that. There's a reason WHY he doesn't label it with an ongoing theme.
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Posted: Sun Dec 17, 2006 5:11 pm
Shikalee mofoslotmachine Shikalee mofoslotmachine Shikalee I don't think the story needs to have a point. I think you guys are reading into this a little too deeply. It's a comic book for kid's for christ's sake. You don't think a story needs to have a point? No. It doesn't. xd Literature does not have to go, "This book was written to do, BLANK." A book is written because an author has an idea. Harry Potter wasn't written to bring magic into our hearts. J.K. Rowling had an AWESOME idea and she put it into a book. An excellent example of this is Chronicle of a Death Foretold. The book was all about one man's death. The only purpose it served was really providing a new type of writing. The story's value had little bearing, except the fact that it made several political statements about the Colombian revolution. Naruto doesn't have to be about HOPE, COURAGE, whatever. A book doesn't REQUIRE a theme, though it may have one. Themes depend on the BOOK, but the book is INDEPENDENT of the themes. Naruto could lose hope and die and then what? Not likely, but it is still possible. It is pretty rash to say NARUTO MEANS THIS when none of you wrote the story, nor know where it's going. "Except the fact that it made several political statements" -- you don't think this is some kind of point? Most literature is usually written with some point in mind, and I think you're misunderstanding what I mean when I say "point". I don't mean stuff like bringing magic into people's hearts, I mean more along the idea of themes and things of significance. HP wasn't written to bring magic into people's hearts, it's just a story about an underdog and a boy growing up and realising his strength, etc. Usually you can pinpoint a theme, and things that run contrary to that theme are unlikely to happen in the storyline. Naruto is all about hope, and even though it doesn't HAVE to be, it has been written that way. It's a pretty typical underdog story: Naruto started out at the bottom (no friends, no family, no real strength) and his tenacity and unwavering hope made him strong, blah blah blah. Having him suddenly get bitten in the neck by an angry Pakkun and dying would be surprising, and would show the dangers of ninja society, etc. etc., but it wouldn't appeal to most readers at all. If that was the way the series ended, I can hazard a guess that most people would be pissed off because there would be so many loose ends left. That's all I mean. Fiction isn't like reality; fiction can't just have everybody die in an avalanche in the end unless it makes sense in the context of the story. But in contrast to your guesses that Naruto is about HOPE is completely different. Making a STATEMENT and playing a ROLE are two entirely different things. You're only saying theme because I brought it up. >_>; Harry Potter does have a theme, but it has nothing to do with strength and all that bull. You don't have a clue what a literary feature such as theme is, do you? If you don't, it's okay. Just don't pretend you do. Because that's annoying. As far as underlying stories go, you're completely assuming. Kishimoto never said that. There's a reason WHY he doesn't label it with an ongoing theme. How about you try replying to me with some civility, rather than arrogance and bitchy comments? Or you could always continue to dismiss the people you're supposed to be arguing with by throwing around pathetic assumptions and insults. Good luck winning any arguments like that, Shikalee. heart
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Posted: Sun Dec 17, 2006 5:22 pm
mofoslotmachine How about you try replying to me with some civility, rather than arrogance and bitchy comments? Or you could always continue to dismiss the people you're supposed to be arguing with by throwing around pathetic assumptions and insults. Good luck winning any arguments like that, Shikalee. heart I don't see why you're saying that, now. This post was totally fair. It was the one BEFORE it you should've been complaining about... If you're just here to argue with me, then you should probably just leave. This is a guild to discuss Naruto-Related stuff. Because the topic we were throwing out was pure speculation, it was your word over mine, which leads nowhere. Therefore, it would be wise not to come back here unless you've got something Naruto-Related to say. And because I'm in a sporty mood, I feel the desire to retort. You're being a b***h too. biggrin So hah.
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Posted: Sun Dec 17, 2006 6:30 pm
Shikalee attilathefun Shikalee I don't think the story needs to have a point. I think you guys are reading into this a little too deeply. It's a comic book for kid's for christ's sake. Probably Kishimoto isn't writing it with a "point" in mind; he's just writing and that's the way it comes out; it's only the point (at least in my opinion) because practically everyone in the comic overcomes adversity like...all the time. Kishimoto makes a big deal out of it. Then, when he rushes it, as it seems like he's doing now, the adversities get compacted and it's fight fight fight BLAH BLAH BLAH and it becomes a mushy, nasty cold oatmeal casserole of no character development unless it will help him FIGHT TEH BAD GUYZ. Exception being Shikamaru's boring, predictable 'I am now super-serious' reaction to Asuma's death. But I guess I wouldn't really call that character growth. edited because I forgot to say things. xd I think the "point" if we want to view it that was is growth. This story displays large amounts of change, and we always expect change throughout the story. Some stories aren't like that. Like Dragonball. xd He isn't rushing. You guys don't know ANYTHING about how he writes or his schedule. He isn't behind; in fact, he's way ahead. He has a team of people helping him ink and such so it doesn't have to be rushed. Like any mangaka, Kishimoto has the whole story already written down. He isn't making it up as he goes along. Kishimoto's work is weeks ahead. It's why he's been on so many vacations. It's why when he writes letters to us, it's about what he's been doing. I've never seen him write about how behind he was. I think you guys are just singling him out. It's pretty odd. First of all, he was always a pretty serious guy. He doesn't lie, and we never see him really unwind. Sure, he's relaxed. But have you ever seen him laugh? By "rushing" I meant rushing through the story with fight after fight after fight--obviously he isn't rushing through the fights themselves, although I question the idea that somebody's not rushing the art, since it looks like s**t. If he already planned this out, he should've noticed that it was getting boring and redunant--but I dunno, maybe most people enjoy boring and redundant stories, and I'm just a weirdo.
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Posted: Sun Dec 17, 2006 9:49 pm
Shikalee But in contrast to your guesses that Naruto is about HOPE is completely different. Making a STATEMENT and playing a ROLE are two entirely different things. You're only saying theme because I brought it up. >_>; Harry Potter does have a theme, but it has nothing to do with strength and all that bull. You don't have a clue what a literary feature such as theme is, do you? If you don't, it's okay. Just don't pretend you do. Because that's annoying. As far as underlying stories go, you're completely assuming. Kishimoto never said that. There's a reason WHY he doesn't label it with an ongoing theme. I think what you're misunderstanding is what we mean by "point". Kishimoto isn't trying to make a big statement about hope and getting through life, etc., but he is regardless. That's just how the story unfolds. And no, he doesn't say that outright, but alot of author's don't. Alot of authors go into stories having something in mind that they want to write about, and others don't. People who write for kids/teenagers specifically usually try to focuse more on a story, rather than a theme. Like, take The Great Gatsby. Fitzgerald definately had a whole point/theme/whatever in mind when he wrote it. He wrote the story and developed the characters around his idea because that's how he could get the point across. Kishimoto focuses on his characters and their lives, rather than proving a specific point. However, that doesn't mean there isn't one. The theme, the point of Harry Potter is that he overcomes the ultimate adversary. He wins, despite being a nice guy who grew up with a muggle family and doesn't get the bestest grades evar. He beats Voldemort, he thwarts the plot, he gets everybody to like him again in the end, because the whole point of that story is that he can overcome. I realize this isn't about Naruto, but since it was used as an example I decided to explain.
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Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2006 6:59 am
Shikalee mofoslotmachine How about you try replying to me with some civility, rather than arrogance and bitchy comments? Or you could always continue to dismiss the people you're supposed to be arguing with by throwing around pathetic assumptions and insults. Good luck winning any arguments like that, Shikalee. heart I don't see why you're saying that, now. This post was totally fair. It was the one BEFORE it you should've been complaining about... If you're just here to argue with me, then you should probably just leave. This is a guild to discuss Naruto-Related stuff. Because the topic we were throwing out was pure speculation, it was your word over mine, which leads nowhere. Therefore, it would be wise not to come back here unless you've got something Naruto-Related to say. And because I'm in a sporty mood, I feel the desire to retort. You're being a b***h too. biggrin So hah. What the heck makes you think I'm here to argue with you? My original comments weren't even directed at you, they were in reply to CrabAppleRed's theories on who's going to die later on in the storyline, so I have no idea where you're pulling that assumption from. I'm in this guild to discuss Naruto, and I've been doing that for a few weeks now. neutral Anyway, I'm not going to be replying to any more off-topic posts because um... it's lame.
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Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2006 8:59 am
Right. So, in an attempt to get things back on track. . .
will Kakuzu and/or Hidan die in this fight? Desite the Boold Puppets of Death that Kakuzu has wipped out, things still look fairly hok for our heros. Added to that, they've got Naruto and co running to the rescue, right? So it seems like a fairly good bet that one of them will die.
On the other hand, loosing more Akatsuki members seems a little . . . well. . . rushed. It would be odd for the heros to decemate the Big Badguys so easily, and so quickly.
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