Bart Ehrman lost all credibility before ever writing this book: suggesting that John's gospel, out of all the gospels, is the only one that ascribes divinity to Jesus is a blatant lie.
Quote:
Matthew 26:63-64 (NIV)
63 But Jesus remained silent.
The high priest said to him, “I charge you under oath by the living God: Tell us if you are the Messiah, the Son of God.”
64 “You have said so,” Jesus replied. “But I say to all of you: From now on you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven.”[a]
Footnotes:
a. Matthew 26:64 See Psalm 110:1; Daniel 7:13.
Quote:
Luke 1:35 (NIV)
35 The angel answered, “The Holy Spirit will come on you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the holy one to be born will be called[a] the Son of God.
Footnotes:
Luke 1:35 Or So the child to be born will be called holy,
Quote:
Luke 21:27 (NIV)
27 At that time they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
Quote:
Mark 3:11-12 (NIV)
11 Whenever the impure spirits saw him, they fell down before him and cried out, “You are the Son of God.” 12 But he gave them strict orders not to tell others about him.
Quote:
Mark 13:26-27 (NIV)
26 “At that time people will see the Son of Man coming in clouds with great power and glory. 27 And he will send his angels and gather his elect from the four winds, from the ends of the earth to the ends of the heavens.
Quote:
Mark 16:19-20 (NIV)
19 After the Lord Jesus had spoken to them, he was taken up into heaven and he sat at the right hand of God. 20 Then the disciples went out and preached everywhere, and the Lord worked with them and confirmed his word by the signs that accompanied it.
The fact that he ascended, sat next to God, and yet is still working miracles with his disciples suggests: not mere human. Jesus is divine. Not to mention his conception by the Holy Spirit and the fact that he'll come riding on clouds (like deity). And all of that before you get to John's gospel.
real eyes realize
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Garland-Green
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Posted: Sun May 04, 2014 6:27 am
real eyes realize
Bart Ehrman lost all credibility before ever writing this book: suggesting that John's gospel, out of all the gospels, is the only one that ascribes divinity to Jesus is a blatant lie.
Quote:
Matthew 26:63-64 (NIV)
63 But Jesus remained silent.
The high priest said to him, “I charge you under oath by the living God: Tell us if you are the Messiah, the Son of God.”
64 “You have said so,” Jesus replied. “But I say to all of you: From now on you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven.”[a]
Footnotes:
a. Matthew 26:64 See Psalm 110:1; Daniel 7:13.
Quote:
Luke 1:35 (NIV)
35 The angel answered, “The Holy Spirit will come on you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the holy one to be born will be called[a] the Son of God.
Footnotes:
Luke 1:35 Or So the child to be born will be called holy,
Quote:
Luke 21:27 (NIV)
27 At that time they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
Quote:
Mark 3:11-12 (NIV)
11 Whenever the impure spirits saw him, they fell down before him and cried out, “You are the Son of God.” 12 But he gave them strict orders not to tell others about him.
Quote:
Mark 13:26-27 (NIV)
26 “At that time people will see the Son of Man coming in clouds with great power and glory. 27 And he will send his angels and gather his elect from the four winds, from the ends of the earth to the ends of the heavens.
Quote:
Mark 16:19-20 (NIV)
19 After the Lord Jesus had spoken to them, he was taken up into heaven and he sat at the right hand of God. 20 Then the disciples went out and preached everywhere, and the Lord worked with them and confirmed his word by the signs that accompanied it.
The fact that he ascended, sat next to God, and yet is still working miracles with his disciples suggests: not mere human. Jesus is divine. Not to mention his conception by the Holy Spirit and the fact that he'll come riding on clouds (like deity). And all of that before you get to John's gospel.
Ehrman claims to have at one point been a born again Christian. I don't know what to think of that. I've met several others who are now avidly against Christianity who have claimed the same. Now I personally don't understand how that is possible. How to have a genuine salvation experience, and then fall so far. Do you think there could be other motives for making such a claim? Do you think it is possible to have at one point been so passionate for Christ, and now be so passionately against Him?
Posted: Sun May 04, 2014 12:31 pm
Garland-Green
real eyes realize
Bart Ehrman lost all credibility before ever writing this book: suggesting that John's gospel, out of all the gospels, is the only one that ascribes divinity to Jesus is a blatant lie.
Quote:
Matthew 26:63-64 (NIV)
63 But Jesus remained silent.
The high priest said to him, “I charge you under oath by the living God: Tell us if you are the Messiah, the Son of God.”
64 “You have said so,” Jesus replied. “But I say to all of you: From now on you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven.”[a]
Footnotes:
a. Matthew 26:64 See Psalm 110:1; Daniel 7:13.
Quote:
Luke 1:35 (NIV)
35 The angel answered, “The Holy Spirit will come on you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the holy one to be born will be called[a] the Son of God.
Footnotes:
Luke 1:35 Or So the child to be born will be called holy,
Quote:
Luke 21:27 (NIV)
27 At that time they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
Quote:
Mark 3:11-12 (NIV)
11 Whenever the impure spirits saw him, they fell down before him and cried out, “You are the Son of God.” 12 But he gave them strict orders not to tell others about him.
Quote:
Mark 13:26-27 (NIV)
26 “At that time people will see the Son of Man coming in clouds with great power and glory. 27 And he will send his angels and gather his elect from the four winds, from the ends of the earth to the ends of the heavens.
Quote:
Mark 16:19-20 (NIV)
19 After the Lord Jesus had spoken to them, he was taken up into heaven and he sat at the right hand of God. 20 Then the disciples went out and preached everywhere, and the Lord worked with them and confirmed his word by the signs that accompanied it.
The fact that he ascended, sat next to God, and yet is still working miracles with his disciples suggests: not mere human. Jesus is divine. Not to mention his conception by the Holy Spirit and the fact that he'll come riding on clouds (like deity). And all of that before you get to John's gospel.
Ehrman claims to have at one point been a born again Christian. I don't know what to think of that. I've met several others who are now avidly against Christianity who have claimed the same. Now I personally don't understand how that is possible. How to have a genuine salvation experience, and then fall so far. Do you think there could be other motives for making such a claim? Do you think it is possible to have at one point been so passionate for Christ, and now be so passionately against Him?
I see two options: one is that they're speaking the truth and maybe we're witnessing Hebrews 6:4-6 in action. Second possibility: they are lying, never truly converted/ never truly went through that born-again process, never arrived at the truth, never believed "I'm wrong and the Holy God of Israel is right" and instead of seeking God's will on a matter, they're only interested in justifying their behavior, they don't want to see the love behind everything God commanded (from beginning to end). If it's the latter, they still have a chance to repent as long as they're breathing and can make that choice: to believe YHWH/Jesus' testimony is right and they were wrong.
real eyes realize
Invisible Guildswoman
Offline
Garland-Green
Friendly Gaian
Offline
Posted: Sun May 04, 2014 12:52 pm
real eyes realize
Garland-Green
real eyes realize
Bart Ehrman lost all credibility before ever writing this book: suggesting that John's gospel, out of all the gospels, is the only one that ascribes divinity to Jesus is a blatant lie.
Quote:
Matthew 26:63-64 (NIV)
63 But Jesus remained silent.
The high priest said to him, “I charge you under oath by the living God: Tell us if you are the Messiah, the Son of God.”
64 “You have said so,” Jesus replied. “But I say to all of you: From now on you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven.”[a]
Footnotes:
a. Matthew 26:64 See Psalm 110:1; Daniel 7:13.
Quote:
Luke 1:35 (NIV)
35 The angel answered, “The Holy Spirit will come on you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the holy one to be born will be called[a] the Son of God.
Footnotes:
Luke 1:35 Or So the child to be born will be called holy,
Quote:
Luke 21:27 (NIV)
27 At that time they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
Quote:
Mark 3:11-12 (NIV)
11 Whenever the impure spirits saw him, they fell down before him and cried out, “You are the Son of God.” 12 But he gave them strict orders not to tell others about him.
Quote:
Mark 13:26-27 (NIV)
26 “At that time people will see the Son of Man coming in clouds with great power and glory. 27 And he will send his angels and gather his elect from the four winds, from the ends of the earth to the ends of the heavens.
Quote:
Mark 16:19-20 (NIV)
19 After the Lord Jesus had spoken to them, he was taken up into heaven and he sat at the right hand of God. 20 Then the disciples went out and preached everywhere, and the Lord worked with them and confirmed his word by the signs that accompanied it.
The fact that he ascended, sat next to God, and yet is still working miracles with his disciples suggests: not mere human. Jesus is divine. Not to mention his conception by the Holy Spirit and the fact that he'll come riding on clouds (like deity). And all of that before you get to John's gospel.
Ehrman claims to have at one point been a born again Christian. I don't know what to think of that. I've met several others who are now avidly against Christianity who have claimed the same. Now I personally don't understand how that is possible. How to have a genuine salvation experience, and then fall so far. Do you think there could be other motives for making such a claim? Do you think it is possible to have at one point been so passionate for Christ, and now be so passionately against Him?
I see two options: one is that they're speaking the truth and maybe we're witnessing Hebrews 6:4-6 in action. Second possibility: they are lying, never truly converted/ never truly went through that born-again process, never arrived at the truth, never believed "I'm wrong and the Holy God of Israel is right" and instead of seeking God's will on a matter, they're only interested in justifying their behavior, they don't want to see the love behind everything God commanded (from beginning to end). If it's the latter, they still have a chance to repent as long as they're breathing and can make that choice: to believe YHWH/Jesus' testimony is right and they were wrong.
Interesting... I suppose it is hard to understand because I have not gone from being a believer into being an unbeliever myself, so it is hard to put myself in this persons shoes. To understand the process. To know if that person was really a born again Christian we would have to know him before his rejection of Jesus, by his fruits so it is hard to judge whether Bart was a born again Christian. It kind of scare me though. The possibility of falling away and in turn be unsavable having "trampled the Son of God underfoot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified them" is terrifying. So a love of God, and His word can prevent you from falling away.
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