[DISCUSSION] Is there a god?

[Tharkun-kazad]

Usually when I hear Wiccan people talking about gods or blessings they say "The Goddess" I've also read that Wicca is a Duotheistic (if that's even a word, but you get the point) Religion, but I never hear about people talking about a god. Is there a god? (soory if I'm being an uneducated fluffy on this matter emo )  

[LadySorcha]

There most definately is a God, but in popular Wiccanism, he is slightly brushed off in favor of worshipping the female divine. Call it a bit of comic justice for the past 2000+ years that She has been forgotten.

In any case, I find that the God is alive and well, and finding followers among Neo-pagans men and boys. The Youth, the Hunter and the Sage are not completely forgotten.  

[The gypsy Queen]

true, its sad that some compleatly forget about the God. crying  

[Angel Bruja]

I know there is supposed to be a god. When you're raised in a patriarchal religion you expect it. It's getting use to the female worship when you switch that you wonder if there is a goddess. BUt I know there is one. The world needs it balances, after all. (This is gong on my own notification, by the way).  

[WitchyBoy]

the god functions mainly in the wilds and is from time to time hard to connect with. but it is so worth it if you can.  

[Tari_Leralonde]

I work with mainly the Goddess, but I always take care to acknowledge and work with the God when in ritual.  

[WitchyBoy]

well think of it this way... if the god never existed the goddess couldnt have birthed the planet and its occupants.  

[Nahrzak]

to say there is a Goddess is to say there is a lack... there are Goddesses... of the one God's creationism... and no woman in her right mind would ever birth the earth in the state it's in from her own womb, that's disgusting... it had to have been a man's job because man is responsible for his relationship with woman, and woman is indepted to man's care, without the care of the man the moan hasn't the means to develop beyond the hand to mouth think and without the developed woman man has no effort or motivation... they go hand in hand and they develop together and it is God who created the earth and universe for Himself and His Daughter/Mother/Wife/Lover because she and all the other Goddesses watch over God when God works at keeping order and peace as well as fighting for the two... Because they are him and he is she and there is no other way.  

[Dragoness Arleeana]

Nahrzak

to say there is a Goddess is to say there is a lack... there are Goddesses... of the one God's creationism... and no woman in her right mind would ever birth the earth in the state it's in from her own womb, that's disgusting... it had to have been a man's job because man is responsible for his relationship with woman, and woman is indepted to man's care, without the care of the man the moan hasn't the means to develop beyond the hand to mouth think and without the developed woman man has no effort or motivation... they go hand in hand and they develop together and it is God who created the earth and universe for Himself and His Daughter/Mother/Wife/Lover because she and all the other Goddesses watch over God when God works at keeping order and peace as well as fighting for the two... Because they are him and he is she and there is no other way.

I don't think I much like you're point of view. It puts the God in far more control when it is equal in Wicca. The Goddess gave birth to the God, gave him his power. The Goddess IS the power, the God is the one who uses that power to make magic and life and everything happen. Without the Goddess the God could not be. Without the God the Goddess would be, but she would be useless. (in one sense or another) the god is active, the Goddess passive. To say that the God is all the power, is the one who enforces it as well and that the goddess is there only because he wants her to be is a completely male shovonist (sp?) view. That is not the wicca belief. The God exists because the Goddess needs him, not the other way around.

I myself worship both the God and Goddess equally (or at least try to) when it comes to ritual. When I work with the egyptian pantheon (which is the only pantheon I work with) I pay worship to TWO Goddesses, Bastet and Isis. This is NOT because I don't feel that the god deserves worship, it's merely because the God of that pantheon has not reached out to me and asked for it. both Goddesses have though, and so I worship them both.  

[Nahrzak]

if I hand a need to respond to you directly i would simply say, "you're retarded." In wicca as of my knowledge there is no relationship with God

God Birthed the Goddess and he himself was birthed as well and or after

There is nothing without God, and there is No God of Love if there are no Goddesses of the same

Both are F'ing Nuetral (aligned with goodness, righteousness, and fairness)

Your contradictions of the vindictive nature by which you apparently persue your exhistance (including perspective) is exactly why you felt the full realm of the confrontation of my previous statement... All Goddesses Desire One thing and one thing alone... The worshiping and prayers of their God. So God was birthed/(even Created by?) the Goddess(es) then if they are to uphold their name... you must admit their preference of worship is their Creative energies manifested In One God. All Goddess are sister. They desire Even strokes... You cannot worship any One (individually) let alone multiple seperates? Psi*(you crazy hoe)* isP

You worship all, through God.

Dae Muhan Vamgon Nahr

P.S What is your perspective on the Two Goddesses You Give Praise to... um.. Bastet and Isis? Oh and by the way... How old are you?  

[HiddenBeliefs]

Nahrzak

if I hand a need to respond to you directly i would simply say, "you're retarded." In wicca as of my knowledge there is no relationship with God

God Birthed the Goddess and he himself was birthed as well and or after

There is nothing without God, and there is No God of Love if there are no Goddesses of the same

Both are F'ing Nuetral (aligned with goodness, righteousness, and fairness)

Your contradictions of the vindictive nature by which you apparently persue your exhistance (including perspective) is exactly why you felt the full realm of the confrontation of my previous statement... All Goddesses Desire One thing and one thing alone... The worshiping and prayers of their God. So God was birthed/(even Created by?) the Goddess(es) then if they are to uphold their name... you must admit their preference of worship is their Creative energies manifested In One God. All Goddess are sister. They desire Even strokes... You cannot worship any One (individually) let alone multiple seperates? Psi*(you crazy hoe)* isP

You worship all, through God.

Dae Muhan Vamgon Nahr

P.S What is your perspective on the Two Goddesses You Give Praise to... um.. Bastet and Isis? Oh and by the way... How old are you?

In Wicca, the Goddess and the God are seen as equals, neither can exist without the other. Female and male are needed for true life.[quote from website i will mention below.]

A man is not responsible for a relationship with a woman, they both are, would a man get near a woman if she didnt want him to? no. unless rape comes in accord, but some woman fight that off too.

whatever you are praticing i can tell you it is not wicca, it may have elements of it in whatever you are practicing... but wicca is not just wholy based on one dominate goddess/god we worship both, maybe you personally will worship one or others like Arleeana worships bastet and isis because they i would say call to her more. like in rituals we use the certain god that has means to the ritual or to us.

there are many gods and goddesses from celtic, irish, greece, italy, egypt etc.

i personally have a connection with Artemis, and Apollo.. as they are the sun and moon and other things, sure i relate more to artemis maybe because shes female or my love of moons, but at times like studying i like athena etc. but generally i will pray etc just to the goddess and god.

~This is a good example.. of what the god and goddess is to wicca.

~The Goddess

The religion of the Goddess has been called both polytheistic and monotheistic at the same time. The Goddess is polytheistic in that she has so many names and forms. She is also monotheistic in that the are all symbols of the single Great Mother, the Creator of All. Joseph Campbell, the historian and mythologist, calls this syncretism.

The Goddess is seen as the power of the feminine, as the creator of all. She is a way to connect to all life on this planet. The Goddess is also an image that has been embraced as a symbol of strength for abused women, a way for self acceptance and esteem, and a model for all women. She is seen in a triple aspect of Maiden, Mother, and Crone. The number 3 is considered sacred in many goddess cultures. The triple aspect of the Goddess enforces the concept.

The trinity of the aspects of the Goddess is also a way to understand and acknowledge the three major stages of human life: youth, parenthood and maturity. The Three aspects of Maiden, Mother, and Crone can also be seen in the three phases of the moon, Full, Waxing and Waning. The cycle of the Goddess is seen in the cycle of human life and in the cycles of the harvest: the empty field, seeds planted and growing, then the harvest.


*************************************

The Maiden
The Maiden is associated with the colors white, light pink and light yellow. She symbolizes youth and anticipation of life, the continuation of life, the season of spring, and the waxing Moon. The Maiden is associated with purity and nature, and is usually seen in the company of animals. In the aspect of the Maiden we see the world with child-like wonder, the beauty of a feather, the mystery of a seed. We also see the Maiden as huntress and warrior, as Athene and Artemis are known to be.


***************************************

The Mother
The color associated with the Mother is red, the color of blood and the life force, and green, a fertile color. The Mother symbolizes summer, ripening, birth, the high point of the cycle, adult and parenthood, and the full Moon. In ancient societies, the pregnant Mother was a metaphor for the fertile fields that sustained the people of the land. The menstrual blood of the Mother has been associated with magick and ritual since Paleolithic times and was thought to have power for healing and fertility.


**************************************

The Crone
The color most associated with the Crone is black, followed by dark purple and grey. The Crone symbolizes death and the end of cycles, winter, night, menopause, age, wisdom, counsel, and the waning Moon. The Crone shows us the way to death and reincarnation. The Crone is past menopause, she has the mystery of time behind her. In the aspect of the Crone we understand that death is a part of life, not something to be feared. She is the teacher of the secret and the hidden.

Ancient European pantheons (a group of gods originating with a certain people), are dominated by the Goddess. She is the creator of the universe, generator of all life. All agricultural societies appear to have worshiped a goddess at one point in their history. In the earliest known creation stories, the Goddess, Mother Nature, call her what you wish, is said to be the source of all being. The Goddess surrounds us, to be found in the earth, moon and stars. She is found in the ebb and flow of the tides, She is found in the bud of a flower. She is found in the creatures of the world. And the Goddess is found inside us. The bodies of women are sacred and holy, not a thing of revulsion that some of the religions of man would have us believe. If the Goddess is inside us and all that surround us, shouldn't we treat all lives as sacred, including ourselves?
Still, she is a mystery never to be fully known.

Why do Wiccans/Witches have so many Goddesses and Gods? Each brings a different strength or attribute to help us in what we are doing. When we work with a goddess we have her power to draw on. For example, Athena will bring creativity and assertiveness, Hera her motivation in new endeavors. Call upon these goddesses when starting a new project. Some Wiccans draw upon the energy of the goddess by tapping into the power of "nature." The Goddesses and Gods can be seen as real beings or as archetypes, (prototypes). The power of all the goddesses and gods of the world are in the very nature of us all. It is within us and in the other inhabitants of this planet, we just have to learn to access that power. It is the power to conjure and create. The diversity of the gods and goddess may help to express the diversity of creation.

In Wicca, the Goddess and the God are seen as equals, neither can exist without the other. Female and male are needed for true life. The Great Mother giving life and giving birth to the world, the God by her side, at times part human, part spirit, part animal. The Goddess and the God each contain a bit of each other, neither is complete without the partner. They compliment each other and are necessary for proper balance.


~The God

The God is usually seen as lover, consort, and son of the Goddess. Both are needed for creation and balance. It is a balance that is shown in myth after myth, culture after culture. As with the Goddess, the God also has many names and associations. There is the god as lover, warrior, and the Horned God of the forests. And there is the god of the mysterious Underworld.

Before the understanding of the biology of humans, pregnancy was thought to be caused by ancestral spirits or the light of the moon. When humans better understood themselves, the God was seen as a life force, an impregnator, and hunter. He has been depicted in art as part animal with horns of a deer or goat and erect phallus. He is also seen as the "Green Man", Lord of the forests.

The power of the God is called upon when help in logic and analysis is wanted. He is also associated with the sun and animals. His association with the sun brings the greening of the harvest. He is the harvest, the animals of the forest, the hunter of those animals when necessary, and the ruler of the woods and mountains. He is the lord of light and represents all that is vital. Women may call upon the God when she feels she needs the strength and assertiveness that he may bring to her.

The first male god form was said to emerge from the Earth Mother. Myths of the creation and the Goddess and God abound in this world, but there are common threads that run through all of them. The God representing the sun, dies each year, only to be reborn in the spring. The story of the Goddess and God are cyclical, as are the seasons of the year. Spring, summer, autumn, winter can be seen in the stories of the Goddess and God. Birth, death, and rebirth are the lessons to be learned. All that dies will return with the sun. The eight holidays of the Wheel are derived from the Creation myths.

Choose the Goddess and God you wish to work with carefully. Research different pantheons. Decide which ones will be best for the working. Your choice may be different with each ritual, depending on the circumstances and desired outcome. Some Wiccans prefer to work with the energy that surrounds us, the energy of the Universe, instead of a particular goddess or god. Use whatever you feel more comfortable with.

website ~ http://www.angelfire.com/realm2/amethystbt/goddessandgod.html

As you see they compliment each other. and there is balance.

Nahrzak where exactly did you learn wicca? because im sorry to tell you that what you practice is not wicca.

-Tharkun-kazad - i hope that the information about the goddess and god from the site posted above answers your question. smile  

[Dragoness Arleeana]

Nahrzak

if I hand a need to respond to you directly i would simply say, "you're retarded." In wicca as of my knowledge there is no relationship with God

God Birthed the Goddess and he himself was birthed as well and or after

There is nothing without God, and there is No God of Love if there are no Goddesses of the same

Both are F'ing Nuetral (aligned with goodness, righteousness, and fairness)

Your contradictions of the vindictive nature by which you apparently persue your exhistance (including perspective) is exactly why you felt the full realm of the confrontation of my previous statement... All Goddesses Desire One thing and one thing alone... The worshiping and prayers of their God. So God was birthed/(even Created by?) the Goddess(es) then if they are to uphold their name... you must admit their preference of worship is their Creative energies manifested In One God. All Goddess are sister. They desire Even strokes... You cannot worship any One (individually) let alone multiple seperates? Psi*(you crazy hoe)* isP

You worship all, through God.

Dae Muhan Vamgon Nahr

P.S What is your perspective on the Two Goddesses You Give Praise to... um.. Bastet and Isis? Oh and by the way... How old are you?

I think Hidden said it all, thank you, oh wise one. wink

As to my perspective on worshipping two Goddesses...I find it very strange actually. I've always felt very comfortable worshipping both the God and Goddess equally, and continue to do so. The Lord and Lady are perfect equals in my mind. But when it come to the Egyptian pantheon, the two Goddesses call to me. At first I felt akward, even ashamed that I did not feel the need to pay worship to a male aspect of that pantheon. But as time went on I realized that I wasn't meant to. The two Goddesses had choosen me to be their own (that's the best way I can put it). It's not my fault no God of the Egyptian pantheon choose to reach out or take notice of me. It's their choice. If ever a God of the Egyptians feels the need to balance things out, I'm sure I'll know and thus give worship to him as well.

As to my age, I don't see how the pertains to anything. Except of course I realize that you're going to say that I'm too young to know anything, as most people tend to do when they're told they're wrong by someone younger. I'm 19, I've been practicing Wicca for 4 years. I've been studying the occult as long as I can remember.  

[WitchyBoy]

without the male there can be no creation without the female there cannot be creation its when the two forces come together can creation occur.
just as there cannot be only light and cannot only be dark, there must be duality.  

[SADERR]

Truthful to say, Nahrzak, you are not quite of traditional wiccan belief.
Naturally, this does not make him "Not a wiccan", as the religion is quite flexible (But not too much, mind you).
And yes, age is a quite a horrid excuse to blame someone. I myself am only 14, but I have been studying it for 3 years now, and I'm pretty sure I have a fair grasp on things.
(My mother has always studied the occult, tarot, astrology, numerology, and what many refer to as "white magic" --And no, please don't start on the whole schpeel about what is and what isn't. I've already heard, and I'm neutral to the topic.) So as soon as I got the balls to mention it to her, she'd told me what she'd known, and set me off on my individual beliefs.

Anyways, my apologies for getting off topic. Whether you mean to or not, Nakrzak, you are making the God sound much more important. Needless to say, they are equal in all aspects. They differ, but manage not to weigh each other out. in mathematical terms:
(God) = (Goddess)
There is no greater than, less than.

So, in a core bottom line, I believe Arleeana is quite right in this, based on the traditional wicca belief system. Feel free to continue your ways, this religion is based around freedom, but do not put it so harshly, nor should you ever claim to follow a traditional wiccan belief system. If anything, this is the oposite end of the stick of Dianic.
Here, let me explain,
THE STICK (Of awesomness)

---Dianic------------Traditional------------You---

But keep in mind, Dianic isn't categorized as wicca anymore (Well, by the majority of the wiccan community) so, make of that what you will.
Do I contradict myself?
Fine then, I contradict myself
I am large -- I contain multitudes
And yes, that quote (by someone who's name slips my mind) is to save me from my post being picked at, but so what?

-Jonathonn  

[Sanguina Cruenta]

Jonathonn

Naturally, this does not make him "Not a wiccan", as the religion is quite flexible (But not too much, mind you).

Well, no. What would make him "not a Wiccan" would be his lack of initiation wink