So what's with this astrology stuff?

[Nihilistic Seraph]

I've allways been fairly touchand-go on that subject, never really placing much faith in it. Mainly, seeing as so many cultures have so completely different associations for different things, how could you work this out in astrology? Much of it seems really vague, and how in the first place could the position of stars affect how you live your life?  

[WebenBanu]

Eh, technically our most common modern zodiac traces its roots back to ancient Egypt, with the Greeks running interference as usual. I agree, however, that I generally don't pay much attention to it. For the most part, if the day's likely to be a bad one then I don't want to know, because if I think it's going to be bad then it definitely will be. If I don't know, however, then I might just pull off being completely oblivious to the metaphysical mayhem all around me.^_~

It's been a while since I read up on it, but as I recall the idea is rooted in the concept of the universe as a great cosmic machine. All things move in time with ma'at, and therefore the configuration of the heavens at the time of a person's birth can be read as a map of this planned order- neither random nor coincidental, it reflects the state of the world at the time that this person came into being. Another concept which followed from this principle was that certain rituals were timed to coincide with particular stars' rising or progress through the sky; a specialized kind of priest was created to track and record the movements of the sky so that the rituals would take place in the appropriate hour, during the appropriate stage of this cosmic machine's cycles. This is where we get the modern occult principle of performing certain rituals at metaphysically appropriate hours of the day or night. ^_^

The ancient Egyptian temples also kept calendars of lucky and unlucky days- these were based on mythical events which were recorded as happening on each day of the year (i.e. Hrw being crowned= a good day, birthday of Ap/p= a bad day). These became very popular toward the later periods, and the Greeks especially loved them. There was a special kind of priest called a horoskopoi by the Greeks, which became more and more specialized and developed the later you go in the Egyptian timeline- their job was simply to know these calendars and explain them to anyone who wanted to use them.

These two ideas were combined very late in Egyptian history, but eventually we got the idea of drawing up a person's natal star chart at birth, in order to divine their fate. For example, if a person was born on a day when some unfortunate mythical event took place involving a crocodile, then that person would be fated to die by a crocodile attack. Further details could be gleaned from the positions of special stars in relation to the constellations and parts of the sky, which the Egyptians had long since learned to track. The Greeks liked it so much, that they had a huge zodiac carved and installed in the ceiling of one of their larger temples- the temple of Hwt-Hrw at Dendera. If you look at the signs of the zodiac, they originate from Egyptian myth. I'm a sun sign Aquarius, btw- whose Egyptian symbol is that of a king or priest pouring a libation of pure water. I've a moon sign of Libra, the scales of Ma'at.  

[Jameta]

The difference in interpretations can possibly be linked to our own cultural and personal meanings we ascribe to things, as with dreams. The Heavens also look different to various individuals, depending on where they're standing.

I'm not one for my day-to-day prediction, but my overall zodiac tends to be fairly accurate: I'm a stubborn ol' goat. whee  

[The Bookwyrm]

Jameta

I'm not one for my day-to-day prediction, but my overall zodiac tends to be fairly accurate: I'm a stubborn ol' goat. whee

The day to day is simply fun to read, and more of a catch all; it's designed to fit everyone under your sign, and the things they most need to look out for. Odds are, someone will experience parts of the prediction.

I prefer a personalized birth chart. It takes your place of birth, as well as date and time, to place stars and planets at the time of your birth, as Banu said, to chart out their influences on you. I had mine done one year as a birthday gift, and I still keep it. Much of it has rung true already, about my personality, ambitions and goals. It's spooky the first time you read it, and then simply funny the second as you actually place it into context.

However, I think that astrology has undergone the same sort of publicity that other forms of divination are undergoing: It's being popularized and produced for large scale manufacturing to a market that has no idea what it really is. The daily horoscope in your local news paper is simply a watered down version of it. Just like Miss Cleo bastardized tarot reading.  

[Atma311]

Like most other people say, I'm not one for the watered down daily horoscopes in the newspapers. I used to think that Astrology was just completely made up until I read what a Scorpio is suppsoed to be and I basically said, "OMG! THAT'S ME! EVERY WORD!!!"

There's a lot of teachers at my college that like to down-talk Astrology, but that's just because:

A) Many (most?) Baptists think Astrology (since it's a divination) is evil... even though the Magi portrayed in the bible were Astrologers and were portrayed as good people...

B) Many people read the newspaper's watered down stuff and think that since it's untrue for them, it's completely fake in all forms.

C) Some are science teachers and Astrology to them is as good as a "fake science" since they can't really explain it.  

[WebenBanu]

I agree about the horoscopes based only on a person's sign. Your average newspaper horoscope or StarScroll(tm) horoscope only takes into account a person's sun sign (most folks don't know what their moon sign is, or that the sign they do know is the sun sign^_~), so it's extremely simplified. Even given that, a zodiac sign covers about an entire month, and there's a lot of room for variations on the positions of various heavenly bodies over a month of different birthdays- even if everyone were born in the same year! So they don't even do a thorough job with the one variable they do consider.^_^' You really can't give an accurate prediction based on only one variable, though- just like you couldn't know a plane's condition or destination simply by knowing its current altitude.

I worked at a metaphysical supply store which would create natal charts- we weren't heavy into astrology, but a couple of the people there were knowledgable on the subject. They'd laugh at the idea of writing a horoscope based only on a person's sun sign.^_^ Newspaper horoscopes are mainly for entertainment- folks shouldn't put any real stock in them, nor should they think that they are an accurate representation of astrology. Unfortunately most people do think that's the extent of astrology, and some people put considerable faith in them.-_-  

[Nihilistic Seraph]

And how is astrology reconciliable with the idea of a mutable future? The same "this is what is likely to happen but can be changed" as with other forms of divination?  

[WebenBanu]

Nihilistic Seraph

And how is astrology reconciliable with the idea of a mutable future? The same "this is what is likely to happen but can be changed" as with other forms of divination?

Yeah, I think this is pretty much the case with all forms of divination. Although at times the ancient Egyptians did seem to have the idea that certain events were absolutely fixed, but you could decide how you were going to react to them and that would decide what happened afterward. But they also believed that there were certain people who would fail to heed any warnings no matter how many times you tried to help them- there was nothing you could do for them, and that might also be fate.  

[The Bookwyrm]

Nihilistic Seraph

And how is astrology reconciliable with the idea of a mutable future? The same "this is what is likely to happen but can be changed" as with other forms of divination?

I've always taken it as a "This is most likely, but not necessarily definate" sort of thing. Kind of like weather prediction works around the premis of most likely.  

[Nihilistic Seraph]

Allright, what about the "how you act depending on your sign"?  

[The Bookwyrm]

Nihilistic Seraph

Allright, what about the "how you act depending on your sign"?

It seems to me like it would be the same sort of deal. Your sign, the planets that were in position at the time of your birth and their positions at that time are all factors. People of a similar sign all seems to share certain characteristics; as a Scorpio I'm terribly moody and have a nose for a secret; I've dated Leos and every last one of them had to be the center of attention. The influence of your sign again provides a "most likely" set of behaviors; not everyone is as affected by others by their sign, and no one will have all of the characteristics associated with it.  

[Nihilistic Seraph]

Because a friend of mine sent me a detailed description of Aquariuses, and some the stuff was so off, it made me laugh.

Andnow I learn that the constelatins have shifted enought that all the sign-to-dates are out of whack, and need two more. How does that work?  

[The Bookwyrm]

Nihilistic Seraph

Andnow I learn that the constelatins have shifted enought that all the sign-to-dates are out of whack, and need two more. How does that work?

Astrology not being my strong suit, I wouldn't know. There's another witch in the family who does astrology, and I've learned most of what I know from her. I hadn't even known they were out of whack. sweatdrop  

[Starlock]

Much pop astrology works because it makes broad, sweeping statements that are generally positive (and if someone says something nice about you, you'll be inclined to agree with it) and also nonfalsifiable (cannot be proven false, and thus very easy to proove to yourself as true if you seek that proof). Whether or not serious astrology is of this nature I can't say, for I haven't yet looked into it.

In general I have a skeptical eye towards any divinatory techniques (which are all nonfalsifiable) and use them more for introspection than any future-telling. Astrology in particular makes me skeptical. I'm sorry, but my destiny ain't goverend by the day I came out of my mother. stare  

[Azana Brown]

*throws in a couple pennies*

The reason people have such a problem with Astrology is because most mainstream things focus ONLY on one's sun sign.

You are MORE than your sun sign! The entire chart, including the locations of ALL planets and their relation to one another, is what determines your personality. If you've read a sun sign profile and have found every word to be true, it's likely that many of your planets are there.

I recommend getting a birth chart done sometime, or doing one yourself and looking up the correspondences. It does a much better job.