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 Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 8:00 pm
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Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 8:06 pm
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Sanguina Cruenta Vice Captain
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Posted: Thu Feb 10, 2011 11:32 am
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Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:50 am
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Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:56 am
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yuffie4657 but i can take care of him. i just cant follow his parents religion. being his godmother is a big deal. i wondering if i should go do the cerimony and be his "godmother" then make a spell to be his guardian. and its not to help his religon its suppose to be another guairdian. and if he needs help with his religon i will help him with whatever he chooses to be or wants to know
While 'godparent' these days has the fallback position of being someone who can care for a child in case of emergency or accident, its' primary modern role is that of religious education. If you can't raise this child as a Christian, wholeheartedly and honestly, then don't promise that you will. It's really just that simple.
Look at it this way. If you agree to become a godparent, you are swearing an oath, to family, clergy, and a God that isn't your own to raise a child in their religion. For me, that's a really big deal. Oaths are not to be taken lightly - and if you swear it, you keep it. Going around it or swearing it falsely only to replace it with something more to your liking without the parents' knowledge or approval is dishonourable - an insult both to your family, your own Gods, and the God you swore false oath to. |
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Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 10:04 am
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Sanguina Cruenta Vice Captain
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Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 10:14 am
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Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 10:32 am
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yuffie4657 the child doesnt even know if he wants to be christian. hes just a baby. i see how ur right about taking the oath, but how can i not want to be such a big part of this babys life. hes not even born yet and i love him so much. ill find a way to do this, im not gonna turn my back on him or his parents. im not taking an oath to be his religous teacher im taking an oath to take care of him. thats it. i know this bc ive seen many baptisms.
You're right - *he's* just a baby. His parents, however, are not, and have the right to choose their child's religious education until he is legally an adult and may choose for himself.
You can still be a huge part of a child's life without being a godparent. You won't be excluding yourself from his life by declining. The fact that you seem willing to do something less than honourable to satisfy your own desires really concerns me, though.
This isn't about you. This is about him, and his parents' wishes. If you just want to agree to look after him without a religious context, get them to declare you his legal guardian in case of accident or emergency. But that's not the only thing they're asking, by doing this in a religious context. They are asking you to raise their child Christian. But you're not a Christian, or a member of their church, and you have no plan to convert. So why do you feel it's in any way correct or proper of you to swear an oath you clearly intent to violate in both the spirit and the letter of? Do you honestly think they'd be happy knowing you're trying to find a work around to the main obligation you'd be agreeing to?
The Lutheran faith is one of the less flexible and more dogmatic denominations out there. Reading about it online seems to reinforce what Sanguina noted: it a serious covenant sworn with the Christian God, to raise the child in the Lutheran faith - meaning regular church meetings, Bible classes, etc - and the sponsors of the child are just as bound by this as the child's parents, and the child themselves. |
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Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 10:29 pm
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Posted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 1:54 am
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yuffie4657 being another legal gaurdian was an option i was looking for but im to young to even consider it...and i know my aunt would take serious offence to it in turn exculding myself from her and the baby (who btw was born today biggrin ) i was thinking about just telling her i was wiccan and hoping she will exept me, but im not so sure. ive been seriously thinking about it and so far im really against being in the baptism and being a godmother, but does anyone really understand how much this baby means to me and how much i want to be more then just his cousin? i havent even met him yet and i know hes gonna be like my own child. ive searched and found no way of finding a good pure ritual for the accation other then a protection spell.
I don't really understand, no. Frankly to me a baby is a wiggling sort of parasite, and I'm not fond of the vast majority of them once they get older, either. I am the oldest of both sides of my family, have more than a dozen cousins (one of whom is 13 years younger than me), and I also have 2 nieces and a nephew - so I have the familial experience. I just don't really like children, or pretend to give a damn/be excited about babies.
I'm also a godparent, to my coven brother's year-old girl. When I was asked I considered it for some time, knowing my own issues with children, and the responsibility being asked of me - I am responsible for her religious education as she grows. If I thought I wasn't able to do that, seriously and thougtfully, and completely 100% in the way my goddaughter's parents expect, I would not have sworn an oath before coven and Gods to do so.
If you've sworn oaths to both coven and the Gods of the Wica on top of all this, it makes this even more clear, and even worse if you break those oaths. Your high priesthood and coven elders should be able to give you some guidance on the matter - at the very least they'll tell you how they feel about the entire situation. However - if you're too young to be a child's legal guardian, how are you old enough to be a Wiccan initiate?
From the sounds of it, you may wish to review the Wicca sticky on the main forum. |
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Sanguina Cruenta Vice Captain
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Posted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 2:13 am
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Posted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 8:49 pm
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Posted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 9:54 pm
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WHY would telling your aunt what you are change ANYTHING about this situation? If anything, it's going to make it more complicated.
If you're not a Lutheran, I find it unlikely they'd let you sponsor the baby as a godparent. Everything I've read requires you to be a church member to do so. Telling your aunt that you're a witch or a pagan isn't going to change that.
Also consider you may be adding an unneeded complication to your situation in revealing your religious path to your aunt. If she and her family are staunchly Christian or conservative, your revelation will likely not be taken well, or accepted. It will add unneeded stress to the situation, and quite possibly get you banned from having access to your cousin. Sort of the opposite of what you want.
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If you aren't old enough to be a legal guardian of this child, leave well enough alone. You may not have the life experience required to properly raise a child, or the resources. Frankly your obsession with this boy, and babies in general, is sort of frightening. It seems unhealthy.
Being a godparent isn't like a backstage all-access path to this kid's life. You're taking on a religious role, first and foremost. It's not about you getting to play with him all the time. it's about you agreeing to take him to church, get him to his bible school classes, teach him about the Bible, and how to pray and generally act as a good Christian. I don't feel like you understand exactly how wrong and hypocritical it seems that you want to sort of brush past all that just because you are more interested in just hanging out with a baby. And it really seems like it doesn't matter WHAT kind of baby...you just want to be a HUGE part of some baby's life.
Well...that's not your place. It's not your kid. His parents get to decide who he hangs out with, and for how long - and it's their right to spend the most time with him. Not yours. If you accept their offer to be a godparent, it's not ok for you to try to diminish that, or usurp it. It's not ok for you to insert yourself into their family because OMG you want it.
Lastly - If you tell your aunt you are a Wiccan, you will be lying to both her and yourself unless you are an initiate in a lineaged coven. I suspect that you are underage for such a thing, since you're not of age to be a legal guardian. There's nothing wrong with being a neo-pagan witch, however, calling eclectic neo-pagan witchcraft Wicca is misleading and inappropriate.
I still feel the best solution to this situation is very, very simple: decline to be the child's godparent. Explain to your aunt how you feel about the baby, and ask to be a bigger part of his life without being either legally or spiritually responsible for his wellbeing. (Don't be surprised if the intensity of your insistence that you'll be such a huge important part of your cousin's life alarms her the way it has me.)
Or, y'know, maybe wait until you have a child of your own, if you seriously want to spend all your time being an important part of a baby's life.
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