So I've been thinking

[Das Rabble Rouser]

The big deal about PDWs like the P90 or the MP7 is the armor piercing capability right? OMG EVIL COP KILLER BULLETS! gonk

Now my big complaint is that these bullets are pretty small and seem ineffective against flesh. Why not make a bullet in say 9mm with say a 4.6mm steel core that is pointed? If the target is not armored you've got a nice heavy bullet (well heavy compared to the normal 4.6x30) to do nice flesh damage. If they are armored then on impact it drives that pointy core through the armor like hammering a nail.

Would this be a worth while idea? I don't think it's going to work well against hard armor but then again I don't think the MP7 was all that effective against hard armor anyway.

EDIT: Yes I know they already make steel core ammo but if I recall it's not pointy.  

[Fresnel]

A beautiful fusion waiting to happen.  

[Das Rabble Rouser]

So it's a hollow point AND armor piercing? Brilliant!  

[Private Sanders]

I want to issue this ammunition in .40 calibre to my fictional military for my writing.  

[Fresnel]

Private Sanders

I want to issue this ammunition in .40 calibre to my fictional military for my writing.

Better not use Glocks.  

[Private Sanders]

Fresnel

Private Sanders

I want to issue this ammunition in .40 calibre to my fictional military for my writing.

Better not use Glocks.

Israeli M5 (Hi-cap M1911, basically).  

[ArmasTermin]

I thought of something like that a long time ago as ammunition to be used in a fictional gun I made up for use in a story. It was blockier than a Glock and had a sort of hand guard that went around from the end of the slide to the end of the frame, making it a big square. It had a computer system located in there that... did something.

Anyway the ammunition was like a hollow point with four petals designed to fragment on impact, a wide base, and a penetrating core that detached upon striking a target.  

[Valkyrie Hatter]

The whole point of bottlenecked cartridges is armor penetrating pistol cartridges at a low cost. What Fres has explained is probably something that only corporate armies can afford.  

[Fresnel]

Valkyrie Hatter

The whole point of bottlenecked cartridges is armor penetrating pistol cartridges at a low cost. What Fres has explained is probably something that only corporate armies can afford.

A box of 20 rounds tends to be quite affordable. Glaser Safety Slugs are nearly $2 a round, but that's only $30 a magazine. Hell, the magazine costs that much.  

[Das Rabble Rouser]

Valkyrie Hatter

The whole point of bottlenecked cartridges is armor penetrating pistol cartridges at a low cost. What Fres has explained is probably something that only corporate armies can afford.

The second picture isn't too bad. It's pretty much a hollow point with a nail in it which is more or less what I was getting at minus the hollow point. That's a good bonus. It's not that difficult to produce. They already make steel core ammo. Make that core pointy and smaller in diameter and that's what I'm getting at. To make this wouldn't be very expensive. I'm guessing the price would be equal to or less than that of 5.7x28 or 4.6x30 since those are pretty expensive from what I hear.  

[Valkyrie Hatter]

Fresnel

Valkyrie Hatter

The whole point of bottlenecked cartridges is armor penetrating pistol cartridges at a low cost. What Fres has explained is probably something that only corporate armies can afford.

A box of 20 rounds tends to be quite affordable. Glaser Safety Slugs are nearly $2 a round, but that's only $30 a magazine. Hell, the magazine costs that much.

Production wise.

@ Rabble: Oh yes a 9mm hollow point with a nail is going to cost more than a FMJ 5.7 bullet tip to produce.

Besides the Russians are already ahead in what you're talking about. They have a PDW that fires 9mm +P+ ammo that gets the same performance as a 5.7 only the wounds are much more devastating.  

[Fresnel]

Valkyrie Hatter

Fresnel

Valkyrie Hatter

The whole point of bottlenecked cartridges is armor penetrating pistol cartridges at a low cost. What Fres has explained is probably something that only corporate armies can afford.

A box of 20 rounds tends to be quite affordable. Glaser Safety Slugs are nearly $2 a round, but that's only $30 a magazine. Hell, the magazine costs that much.

Production wise.

@ Rabble: Oh yes a 9mm hollow point with a nail is going to cost more than a FMJ 5.7 bullet tip to produce.

Besides the Russians are already ahead in what you're talking about. They have a PDW that fires 9mm +P+ ammo that gets the same performance as a 5.7 only the wounds are much more devastating.

Actually, I don't think it would be very hard at all to cast a copper hollowpoint around a hardened steel point. It's made even easier by copper having a lower melting point.  

[Valkyrie Hatter]

Fresnel

Valkyrie Hatter

Fresnel

Valkyrie Hatter

The whole point of bottlenecked cartridges is armor penetrating pistol cartridges at a low cost. What Fres has explained is probably something that only corporate armies can afford.

A box of 20 rounds tends to be quite affordable. Glaser Safety Slugs are nearly $2 a round, but that's only $30 a magazine. Hell, the magazine costs that much.

Production wise.

@ Rabble: Oh yes a 9mm hollow point with a nail is going to cost more than a FMJ 5.7 bullet tip to produce.

Besides the Russians are already ahead in what you're talking about. They have a PDW that fires 9mm +P+ ammo that gets the same performance as a 5.7 only the wounds are much more devastating.

Actually, I don't think it would be very hard at all to cast a copper hollowpoint around a hardened steel point. It's made even easier by copper having a lower melting point.

It's probably not as easy as producing an FMJ.  

[Fresnel]

Valkyrie Hatter

Fresnel

Valkyrie Hatter

Fresnel

Valkyrie Hatter

The whole point of bottlenecked cartridges is armor penetrating pistol cartridges at a low cost. What Fres has explained is probably something that only corporate armies can afford.

A box of 20 rounds tends to be quite affordable. Glaser Safety Slugs are nearly $2 a round, but that's only $30 a magazine. Hell, the magazine costs that much.

Production wise.

@ Rabble: Oh yes a 9mm hollow point with a nail is going to cost more than a FMJ 5.7 bullet tip to produce.

Besides the Russians are already ahead in what you're talking about. They have a PDW that fires 9mm +P+ ammo that gets the same performance as a 5.7 only the wounds are much more devastating.

Actually, I don't think it would be very hard at all to cast a copper hollowpoint around a hardened steel point. It's made even easier by copper having a lower melting point.

It's probably not as easy as producing an FMJ.

Neither is producing HPBT, but it still sells for under a buck a round. Point is, regular Hydrashok ammo looks pretty damn tough to manufacture to begin with. Making the center post steel wouldn't change that much.  

[Valkyrie Hatter]

Fresnel

Valkyrie Hatter

Fresnel

Valkyrie Hatter

Fresnel

Valkyrie Hatter

The whole point of bottlenecked cartridges is armor penetrating pistol cartridges at a low cost. What Fres has explained is probably something that only corporate armies can afford.

A box of 20 rounds tends to be quite affordable. Glaser Safety Slugs are nearly $2 a round, but that's only $30 a magazine. Hell, the magazine costs that much.

Production wise.

@ Rabble: Oh yes a 9mm hollow point with a nail is going to cost more than a FMJ 5.7 bullet tip to produce.

Besides the Russians are already ahead in what you're talking about. They have a PDW that fires 9mm +P+ ammo that gets the same performance as a 5.7 only the wounds are much more devastating.

Actually, I don't think it would be very hard at all to cast a copper hollowpoint around a hardened steel point. It's made even easier by copper having a lower melting point.

It's probably not as easy as producing an FMJ.

Neither is producing HPBT, but it still sells for under a buck a round. Point is, regular Hydrashok ammo looks pretty damn tough to manufacture to begin with. Making the center post steel wouldn't change that much.

Interesting but you still need to get that bullet to fly at a high enough velocity to penetrate armor. I think the Russians are actually onto something there.