Seceding from the States

[X-Yami-no-Ko-X]

I'm not really big on politics and I know not everyone here is from the USA, but I found this interesting and wanted different views on this.

Surfing Facebook, I found this link. At first I was a bit surprised. Like "They're really trying to do that?" Then I sat back and thought "Maybe this is the change that needs to happen." Personally I've never liked politics. I thought it was a lot of stupid back and forth that people fall for. Then I started thinking even more. I had to laugh that this morning in Sociology, my professor asked us how we would bring about social change (we've been studying the chapters on stratification).

So what are your views on it? I'm curious as to what other USA citizens think and what people outside of the USA think about it.
Also, do you guys think that they'll get the signatures they need for it to be considered?  

[Andre_Yates]

I doubt they can get the signatures they need but it is interesting since no state have done this since the civil war.  

[too2sweet]

Last I heard, Texas is actually pretty close at somewhere around 23,000 signatures (think they need like 25,000). Even so though, I don't know that anything will come of it. From what I understand these petitions pop up from time to time, especially after elections.

I do think that we need some serious government reform, but don't think that seceding would be the best way to make that happen (not really sure what is). Having said that though, I do think it's pretty clear (from the last 3+ election cycles) that this country is seriously split in our ideals and values - so maybe it's time to split up so we can all be happy for a change.  

[iKillCaustic]

Oh yeah I heard about this today.
Personally I don't really care what happens, but it reminds me of something my (Texan) uncle told me when I was over in the USA a couple of years ago - Texas is apparently the only state legally allowed to become it's own country if need be. I dunno if this is true or not because I was still too jetlagged at that stage to concentrate on foreign politics.  

[kyndryana3]

That is more than a little wacky. All I can think of is it reminds me of a little kid who doesn't get their way so they throw a tantrum and lock themselves in their room.

I wonder how many of those people who are signing this petition voted...and of those that vote, how many of them do anything else ever to promote their political stance besides voting for the president.

If you aren't willing to do the work, don't complain because other people are doing it in a way you don't like.  

[rmcdra]

Most states don't have the infrastructure to be independent. What's going to happen when a state needs something that it doesn't produce, are they going to expect to import it from the US with no complications? Also what about the people living in those states that are on SSDI or other federal assistance? I think most are not think it through all the way. Seceding is going to cause more problems then it will help.  

[X-Yami-no-Ko-X]

Oh I found something interesting. This would probably piss those people off that signed. The Proclamation mentioned

And Texas did get the signatures they needed
Wait what? More than 30 are petitioning? Though I have to say that's kinda funny the counter petition. But how would they be able to find the people who signed it? Track the IP address?

Quote:

Ohio can stand on its own as a free and independent nation, separate from the United States of America, while remaining on friendly terms with the United States of America.

I really don't know what I can say about this right here except this is bullshit.

And I also think that those signing the petition for a state to secede should be from that state too. I was looking over the Ohio one and of the ones I saw it looked like out of state outnumbered the people that actually live in Ohio.

too2sweet

I do think that we need some serious government reform, but don't think that seceding would be the best way to make that happen (not really sure what is). Having said that though, I do think it's pretty clear (from the last 3+ election cycles) that this country is seriously split in our ideals and values - so maybe it's time to split up so we can all be happy for a change.

I do agree that seceding would not be the best way. But with how much coverage this is getting and the fact that Texas did get the signatures maybe it will get others to stand up and try to bring about the change in a better way.

rmcdra

Most states don't have the infrastructure to be independent. What's going to happen when a state needs something that it doesn't produce, are they going to expect to import it from the US with no complications? Also what about the people living in those states that are on SSDI or other federal assistance? I think most are not think it through all the way. Seceding is going to cause more problems then it will help.

I completely agree with this. I really don't think people did think it all the way through. I really wonder how many people that have signed these petitions are on some kind of federal assistance.

Though another thing. What about the residents that still want to be part of the US? What would they do about those people IF their state does secede?
Edit: Oh and what would happen with the military currently in those states.  

[iKillCaustic]

kyndryana3

That is more than a little wacky. All I can think of is it reminds me of a little kid who doesn't get their way so they throw a tantrum and lock themselves in their room.

I wonder how many of those people who are signing this petition voted...and of those that vote, how many of them do anything else ever to promote their political stance besides voting for the president.

If you aren't willing to do the work, don't complain because other people are doing it in a way you don't like.

And this is why in Australia, it is compulsory to vote. That way people can't use the excuse of "Hey we didn't vote at all but you're doing a s**t job so leave."  

[too2sweet]

I was thinking a bit more about this the other night, and it occurs to me that it's sort of like a rebellious teen that didn't get his/her way and is all like... ok, now I'm just going to run away.

If there are issues (and clearly there are) with the way the government is being run, actually do something about it. Don't just run away from the problems. We are in the mess we are in, because a large majority of one side, has literally refused to even attempt to come to any sort of compromise on, or find an alternate solution to what is currently being proposed (or is already in place).

Maybe instead of sticking their fingers in their ears, and thinking they know everything, if people would actually go back to working together (at least making an attempt to), we might get something accomplished.  

[X-Yami-no-Ko-X]

too2sweet

I was thinking a bit more about this the other night, and it occurs to me that it's sort of like a rebellious teen that didn't get his/her way and is all like... ok, now I'm just going to run away.

If there are issues (and clearly there are) with the way the government is being run, actually do something about it. Don't just run away from the problems. We are in the mess we are in, because a large majority of one side, has literally refused to even attempt to come to any sort of compromise on, or find an alternate solution to what is currently being proposed (or is already in place).

Maybe instead of sticking their fingers in their ears, and thinking they know everything, if people would actually go back to working together (at least making an attempt to), we might get something accomplished.

cat_gonk Why can't we tip in the guilds?
Because now that you mention it, it really does sound like a kid that didn't get their way and I love the comparison.  

[iKillCaustic]

Now that you mention it too2sweet, your point sums up the whole situation quite well.  

[BrokeTheMoon]

Honestly I think the states are being childish... sweatdrop I mean Texas could manage on its own having its own government and enough people to sustain itself. But from what I recall there is such thing as checks and balances and if the president is a Democrat and the House is mostly Republican..nothing is going to get done anyway.

But that's just my thoughts  

[X-Yami-no-Ko-X]

BrokeTheMoon

But from what I recall there is such thing as checks and balances and if the president is a Democrat and the House is mostly Republican..nothing is going to get done anyway.

At lot of compromises will happen. They're already talking about entitlements and what to do about those.  

[BrokeTheMoon]

X-Yami-no-Ko-X

BrokeTheMoon

But from what I recall there is such thing as checks and balances and if the president is a Democrat and the House is mostly Republican..nothing is going to get done anyway.

At lot of compromises will happen. They're already talking about entitlements and what to do about those.

My mom, when I discussed this with her and we had a laugh, also brought up how confusing it would be if we wanted to go to one of the states that remains in the union...would we need passport just to go to ____(Insert state here)? :/ But I guess fortunately the states that we travel to are all wanting to secede. (I'm from a southern state) This is when the idea first came around though. Usually Facebook blows up with this kind of information and I haven't seen anything big.


sweatdrop This is all just too sticky. I was surprised that New York and New Jersey were on the list to secede. But just a random thought...if these states do secede wouldn't getting imports from the remaining states in the Union kinda boost the remaining economy?  

[X-Yami-no-Ko-X]

BrokeTheMoon

My mom, when I discussed this with her and we had a laugh, also brought up how confusing it would be if we wanted to go to one of the states that remains in the union...would we need passport just to go to ____(Insert state here)? :/ But I guess fortunately the states that we travel to are all wanting to secede. (I'm from a southern state) This is when the idea first came around though. Usually Facebook blows up with this kind of information and I haven't seen anything big.


sweatdrop This is all just too sticky. I was surprised that New York and New Jersey were on the list to secede. But just a random thought...if these states do secede wouldn't getting imports from the remaining states in the Union kinda boost the remaining economy?

I only saw one thing on Facebook. And it was the first article I found. Someone on my friends list had read it. And last count I heard about was all 50 wanted to secede so the only thing left would be DC if they get the signatures. As of yesterday 11 states got the signatures. It surprises me that Ohio was one of them.

Quote:

As of Monday afternoon, 11 would-be seceding states – Texas, Georgia, South Carolina, Louisiana, Missouri, Tennessee, North Carolina, Alabama, Oklahoma, Florida and Ohio – have reached the 25,000-signature threshold that the “We the People” website promises will gain an official Obama administration review. Nine of the 11 states voted against Obama in the Nov. 6 election, with only Florida and Ohio as pro-Obama outliers.

Article
They still haven't released what the government's going to do about it yet.