Power of Imagination

[Starlock]

Imagination is sometimes said to be among the most useful and important tools in magic. Imagination can be defined as "the act or power of forming a mental image of something not present to the senses or never before wholly perceived in reality" according to Merriam-Webstern online dictionary. Looking at this definition we may see paralells between imagionation and techniques such as visualization or any perception of phenomena not readily measured and studied by the scientific method. Those who follow magical paths see the unseen reality. To mainstream society this may at times mean we're just delusional but most of those in the Neopagan community attach special significance to inner journeys of the imagination.

arrow How do you define imagination? How is the imagined, the inner worlds different from the outer worlds? Is one more 'real than the other?

arrow How do you think imagination relates to the practice of Witchcraft or whatever Neopagan or Occult practice you follow? How does it tie into the use of magic, communication with deities, and such?  

[Twack]

I love useing my imagination...*Pauses noticing spongebob refferance*

I use my imigination all the time, like when im charging a crystal or something of the sort. When i'm communicating with a spirit guide. or even when i'm walking between the worlds.
I believe both to be as real as the other, i just feel that thouse who don't fallow pagan paths to be like menatly handicaped people, no offence it'll make sence, in the fact that more often then not they don't realize that they are any diffrent from what society call 'normal'.

There is no reality only perception  

[Nihilistic Seraph]

Imagination is wonderful, it gets me through my shifts at work.

I honestly find imagination to be the most vital part of magical workings. The strogner you are able to imagine your object, the better things go.  

[Neko_Bast]

Imagination is seeing anything that is not vuable with the eyes. Most of what is visualised in magic comes from the imagination. Since visualisation is a big part of magic and most pagan faiths, I would say that imagination is improtant.  

[safkef]

Starlock

arrow How do you define imagination? How is the imagined, the inner worlds different from the outer worlds? Is one more 'real than the other?

arrow How do you think imagination relates to the practice of Witchcraft or whatever Neopagan or Occult practice you follow? How does it tie into the use of magic, communication with deities, and such?

Imagination, to me, is the process of visualizing and making real that which isn't able to be seen or viewed. The imagined world intersects with the real world because energy is what creates and when you spend time imagining something, you have given it energy and thus some form whether it be in your mind or visible to others. I think that reality is pretty unreal sometimes so I don't know if I can say that imagination is less real than that.

I think imagination is essential to the practice of paganism, simply because we work with energy and that isn't always visible. If you are unable to visualize, or "imagine", energy than how can you work with it?

Communication with deities requires nothing but imagination. Again, you cannot see deities (obviously you can see them in the things around us but you know what I mean) so you have to imagine their form to give you something to focus on.

Just my opinion smile As always, feel free to ignore it lol and hey, vote for my avatar in the arena LOL  

[twilight insanity]

i didn't ignore a word of what anyone said. i can only say, wow. bravo you guys! razz you all seem to have read this somewhere cause you all sound like your saying mostly the same thing! xd anyway, i didn't read this up, but i do know a thing or two about imagination. lets see if i can put it into words without making myself seem like the big fool i keep seeming to come out seeming like when i reply in all these threads! sweatdrop xp ok. i believe that if i couldn't imagine, i wouldn't even be able to exist. it's as if my whole personality is a .... creation of my imagination. i tend to mold my world, and also, i have created my own little word. i call it Gray. it is somewhat of a kind of psychic faerie world. it is my link to everywhere else, and my escape from a darker side of myself and my own mind. it was a sort of last resort to keep me from becoming wholly engulfed by the devilsh, animalistic part of my mind that unfortunately had become invaded by demons. it realy makes life difficult. i learned how to mix these worlds, and the dimensions or universes that make up my existence in the form of body, mind, heart, and soul. i imagine it as a kind of web, or weave. and, as imagination is obviously the key, this visualization makes it simple for me to pick and change. connecting it in certain ways. changing it whenever i like, however i like. i call my dream world Gray because that color is what it is like. more of a negative spectrum than anything else, a parallel. it is subject to my ultimate control. i make the rules. some examples are that time does not exist, it is always twilight, except on occasion. you see? it is where my mind comes alive. people tell me all the time i look like i am on drugs because i definately have a high. truth is, i don't do anything, but still i get high just like that. and i always get high during twilight.  

[Pelta]

And Many More

I believe both to be as real as the other, i just feel that thouse who don't fallow pagan paths to be like menatly handicaped people, no offence it'll make sence, in the fact that more often then not they don't realize that they are any diffrent from what society call 'normal'.

Wow... I think that's the most offensive thing I've read all day. confused

On topic, I'm going to disagree with what everyone's said so far. There is a distinct difference between imagination and magic, firstly being the imagination is not real. There is a difference between perception and just making things up.

Experiencing magic is different from simply "making up" an effect. Imagining a shield is definately different from actually creating one. Imagination is essential to the practise of magic as a way of exploring what can be done. However, imagination is not magic. The willfull use of energy effects experience in the material world - imagination is a phenomenon contained within a person's head. Now, what has been imagined can be brought to fruition with the proper application of effort and energy, but, like a dream, it's not going to come true just because you dreamed it.

Back to Starlock's original question, I see a huge difference between magic and the practise of "visualisation." Magic is real and can be perceived by the senses. Imagination is dangerous in many respects because it can goof you into believing what does not exist.

One of a magician's greatest fears is that they're just making everything up.  

[Goddess Hekate]

First of, imagination is inside one self as Pelta said.
I feel sad for people who lack a good imagination because it's what sets us apart from animals it's what innovates the world. That doesn't mean I pity them I just feel sad that they haven't learned what a great thing imagination is.
I Actively use imagination as a writter I can in my head spin worlds, weave skies and thread the lines of some poor sods destiny, I like this of course and it centers me mentally (note: not spiritually)

I'll try to explain it in a zen-buddhist way. When solving a koan like the sound of one hand clapping or understanding mu(emptiness) it's not enough to be able to know it inside one self (imagination) sort of: I can imagine inside that everything is mu, but it isn't before acknowledgement that mu isn't just inside you but also outside you and is everything that you've solved the koan.

So imagination isn't magic it's just inside you, when it's blown out of your mind and into everything else that's when you can talk about magic. But I might be influenced by my recent exploration of Hinduism. *shrugs*  

[twilight insanity]

Goddess Hekate

First of, imagination is inside one self as Pelta said.
I feel sad for people who lack a good imagination because it's what sets us apart from animals it's what innovates the world. That doesn't mean I pity them I just feel sad that they haven't learned what a great thing imagination is.
I Actively use imagination as a writter I can in my head spin worlds, weave skies and thread the lines of some poor sods destiny, I like this of course and it centers me mentally (note: not spiritually)

I'll try to explain it in a zen-buddhist way. When solving a koan like the sound of one hand clapping or understanding mu(emptiness) it's not enough to be able to know it inside one self (imagination) sort of: I can imagine inside that everything is mu, but it isn't before acknowledgement that mu isn't just inside you but also outside you and is everything that you've solved the koan.

So imagination isn't magic it's just inside you, when it's blown out of your mind and into everything else that's when you can talk about magic. But I might be influenced by my recent exploration of Hinduism. *shrugs*

so then, if for example someone imagined the creation of lit candle floating in front of him/her, and they aplied enough willpower and energy to make that image visible to everyone else by the power of the mind itself, the act of their spychic metacreativity of the candle would not be considered imagination anymore? i don't see how that is so, because after all, it is still completely controled by you imagining it. and would it be considered only illusion if it was practical? if it shed light, gave off warmth, could be held? that is my question.  

[Starlock]

There are some authors and Neopagans who say that magic is often *not* something that is seen, though its effects may be seen. This is perhaps to keep the wishful thinking individuals from getting a bit carried away with everything (ie "I can really make fireballs out of thin air!"). Some define magic as the ability to shift one's lenses of perception to create desired effects; imagination is one tool for doing that.

... and I completely lost my train of thought on this. It's an interesting day at work today. sweatdrop  

[Goddess Hekate]

auronclone

Goddess Hekate

First of, imagination is inside one self as Pelta said.
I feel sad for people who lack a good imagination because it's what sets us apart from animals it's what innovates the world. That doesn't mean I pity them I just feel sad that they haven't learned what a great thing imagination is.
I Actively use imagination as a writter I can in my head spin worlds, weave skies and thread the lines of some poor sods destiny, I like this of course and it centers me mentally (note: not spiritually)

I'll try to explain it in a zen-buddhist way. When solving a koan like the sound of one hand clapping or understanding mu(emptiness) it's not enough to be able to know it inside one self (imagination) sort of: I can imagine inside that everything is mu, but it isn't before acknowledgement that mu isn't just inside you but also outside you and is everything that you've solved the koan.

So imagination isn't magic it's just inside you, when it's blown out of your mind and into everything else that's when you can talk about magic. But I might be influenced by my recent exploration of Hinduism. *shrugs*

so then, if for example someone imagined the creation of lit candle floating in front of him/her, and they aplied enough willpower and energy to make that image visible to everyone else by the power of the mind itself, the act of their spychic metacreativity of the candle would not be considered imagination anymore? i don't see how that is so, because after all, it is still completely controled by you imagining it. and would it be considered only illusion if it was practical? if it shed light, gave off warmth, could be held? that is my question.

No it is impossible to light a candle by imagining it, pyro/psycho-kinesis doesn't work with imagination. Like I said imagination is inside. psychokinesis works like when you make your hand move, it's not imagined it's done.

Ok... I read without comprehension anyways...

Also telepathy isn't considered magic atleast not by me.

Hypothetically if this was feasable it would not be imagination since it exists outside of your own mind into the perception of someone else without there being telepathy involved.  

[twilight insanity]

Goddess Hekate

auronclone

Goddess Hekate

First of, imagination is inside one self as Pelta said.
I feel sad for people who lack a good imagination because it's what sets us apart from animals it's what innovates the world. That doesn't mean I pity them I just feel sad that they haven't learned what a great thing imagination is.
I Actively use imagination as a writter I can in my head spin worlds, weave skies and thread the lines of some poor sods destiny, I like this of course and it centers me mentally (note: not spiritually)

I'll try to explain it in a zen-buddhist way. When solving a koan like the sound of one hand clapping or understanding mu(emptiness) it's not enough to be able to know it inside one self (imagination) sort of: I can imagine inside that everything is mu, but it isn't before acknowledgement that mu isn't just inside you but also outside you and is everything that you've solved the koan.

So imagination isn't magic it's just inside you, when it's blown out of your mind and into everything else that's when you can talk about magic. But I might be influenced by my recent exploration of Hinduism. *shrugs*

so then, if for example someone imagined the creation of lit candle floating in front of him/her, and they aplied enough willpower and energy to make that image visible to everyone else by the power of the mind itself, the act of their spychic metacreativity of the candle would not be considered imagination anymore? i don't see how that is so, because after all, it is still completely controled by you imagining it. and would it be considered only illusion if it was practical? if it shed light, gave off warmth, could be held? that is my question.

No it is impossible to light a candle by imagining it, pyro/psycho-kinesis doesn't work with imagination. Like I said imagination is inside. psychokinesis works like when you make your hand move, it's not imagined it's done.

Ok... I read without comprehension anyways...

Also telepathy isn't considered magic atleast not by me.

Hypothetically if this was feasable it would not be imagination since it exists outside of your own mind into the perception of someone else without there being telepathy involved.

...the ability to make something real by imagining it is perfectly real, and psychic powers are everything to do with imagination and thought. every part of the mind. also, the difference between magic and ESP is irrelevant. after all, we're talking more about how imagination and reality effect eachother anyway.  

[Pelta]

twilight insanity

...the ability to make something real by imagining it is perfectly real...

Um... Not entirely. Imagining I have a car will not give me one. Imagining a million Euro, no matter how great that would be, will not make me rich. Imagination is not the same as reality

Quote:

...and psychic powers are everything to do with imagination and thought.

I only half agree with that. Yes, they're everything to do with thought, but the ability to do anything comes from actually doing it, not thinking about it or imagining it. Thinking about moving something is not the same as actually picking it up and moving it. Imagining it moving will also not move said object. It is the actual action that has effect in the pysical world - not the imagining thereof.  

[twilight insanity]

Pelta

twilight insanity

...the ability to make something real by imagining it is perfectly real...

Um... Not entirely. Imagining I have a car will not give me one. Imagining a million Euro, no matter how great that would be, will not make me rich. Imagination is not the same as reality

Quote:

...and psychic powers are everything to do with imagination and thought.

I only half agree with that. Yes, they're everything to do with thought, but the ability to do anything comes from actually doing it, not thinking about it or imagining it. Thinking about moving something is not the same as actually picking it up and moving it. Imagining it moving will also not move said object. It is the actual action that has effect in the pysical world - not the imagining thereof.

look, all i'm saying is that psychic power is real, and that if you will it with your mind, which invoves imagining it, then it can happen. not like it's easy. i am floridian, don't try to argue with me when i am being stubborn. it won't work.  

[Pelta]

Actually, I wasn't trying to argue. You're perfectly entitled to your own opinion. mrgreen